Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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In Transit
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by In Transit »

boronia wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:52 pm I particularly recall Constance's admissions that passengers on the upper deck "would have to duck while going under the bridges" at Parramatta, and the public outcry that resulted.
There were also media reports of the "new Parramatta ferry" taken at Parramatta during trials..
It wasn't an admission - it was a statement of fact that you couldn't ride on the upper deck west of Rydalmere due to clearances, one that was always planned but was then twisted in the public arena. There was the choice of providing an upper deck but having to close it beyond Rydalmere, or instead not having an upper deck at all. I know which one I'd prefer. As Linto63 points out, it's not actually something new. However, it became an ongoing media farce, continually perpetuated by lazy journalists and, it seems, even online here.

It has close parallels with the NIF rolling stock and loading gauge on the Blue Mountains line - there was a deliberate decision made to finally rectify what had been an issue for years requiring narrower rolling stock (with implications such as the gap between train and platform) and when the government took the right decision - not the easy and cheapest solution - to fix this problem, instead there's been ongoing headlines about buying trains that are too wide. This does point to the unerring inability of this government to explain and sell what it is doing, even when its actually the right decision, but its also a symptom of the febrile media that we get these days (perpetuated by opposition politicians and other attention seekers, for whom the facts are irrelevant). Constance in particular lost all public credibility regarding ferries when he had that brain snap about Ferry McFerryFace - from then on he was just a figure of public ridicule as far as ferries are concerned.

As for media reports of the "new Parramatta ferry".. well it is. It operates on the Parramatta River (F3) and can operate to Parramatta. However, they weren't acquired to replace the RiverCats, so I really don't understand what you are getting at here. The reason more vessels are being acquired is to replace the RiverCats. This should be a good news story - more investment in the public transport network.

This kind of nonsense is why sometimes we can't have nice things, when politicians and departments realise that even taking the right decisions can result in ongoing attacks. Much easier to take the low risk solution of doing nothing.... and then you'd genuinely have something to whinge about.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Linto63 »

The confusion is understandable, one could assume that the River class were to replace the similarly named River Cats. While the media may be guilty of misrepresenting events at times, in the last few years this government has overseen some botched transport asset procurement, this becoming yet another.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by alleve »

Linto63 wrote: Fri Feb 24, 2023 12:42 pm The confusion is understandable, one could assume that the River class were to replace the similarly named River Cats. While the media may be guilty of misrepresenting events at times, in the last few years this government has overseen some botched transport asset procurement, this becoming yet another.
The light rail especially, where neither class of tram is correct for their lines.

You've also got to wonder what exactly was going through Constance's head re: Ferry McFerryface
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by tonyp »

In Transit wrote: Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:59 am This kind of nonsense is why sometimes we can't have nice things, when politicians and departments realise that even taking the right decisions can result in ongoing attacks. Much easier to take the low risk solution of doing nothing.... and then you'd genuinely have something to whinge about.
All these things are victims of the modern passion for "spin", especially through social media pitched at the lowest common denominator, rather than old-fashioned laying out of facts - often including diagrams and plans. They assume everybody is an idiot and everything has to be put forward in the simplest terms. As boronia will have observed, there are many very intelligent and educated members of the public out there and many of these official social media announcement posts are full of comments from people explaining everything in more detail. A job that government (and in our case TfNSW which is just as bad) should be doing itself.

Naturally, this is easy meat for an opposition party seeking to be elected. All it has to do is keep repeating the relevant simplistic slogans over and over again until it sticks in the minds of voters. On their website, the NSW Liberals have posted an impressive list of what they've achieved so far in capital works and procurement and what they plan to do in the next several years. That list should be out there everywhere because few people are going to going to go looking up their website.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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Alert today
"The following services are cancelled for today due to staff illness,
- 11:28am and 12:28pm Parramatta to Circular Quay service and
- 4:02pm and 6:02pm Circular Quay to Parramatta service."
I thought Parramatta Wharf was closed until the end of this month.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by boronia »

I think a "Parramatta service" would include those that have scheduled bus connections to/from Rydalmere?
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Linto63 »

Another Emerald II failure. Clearly despite reassurances that they are on top of it, clearly Transdev are not.

New Manly ferry suffers another steering failure on Sydney Harbour (Sydney Morning Herald)
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Merc1107 »

Are they really Chinese built as the article alleges? If so it's no surprise at all they're having issues. Even if we're averse to Australian-made, there are any number of nations who could surely supply a suitable product.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by tonyp »

Merc1107 wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 1:43 pm Are they really Chinese built as the article alleges? If so it's no surprise at all they're having issues. Even if we're averse to Australian-made, there are any number of nations who could surely supply a suitable product.
They were fitted out at Birdens, the principal contractor, at Port Macquarie NSW, so this will be a warranty issue for them.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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The first Emeralds had similar problems, but both versions came from the same design house.

The other problem has been the inability to handle swells across the heads. The MFFs don't seem to have these problems.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Linto63 »

Merc1107 wrote: Even if we're averse to Australian-made, there are any number of nations who could surely supply a suitable product.
Probably not for the same price though. If TfNSW had its time over again it would have just paid the extra to have Incat build them in Hobart.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Merc1107 »

Very true. Although if a more expensive (and less trouble-prone) ferry had been procured, the cost of having to retain the Freshwater could have been averted? Or was the hysteria around their withdrawal inevitable?
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Linto63 »

There was always going to be some noise, much like when the Freshwaters predecessors were withdrawn, but had the government stayed the course it would have died down by now. The Emeralds ongoing problems have certainly played into the hands of the detractors though.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by boronia »

Linto63 wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:37 pm
Merc1107 wrote: Even if we're averse to Australian-made, there are any number of nations who could surely supply a suitable product.
Probably not for the same price though. If TfNSW had its time over again it would have just paid the extra to have Incat build them in Hobart.
This is assuming that Incat had the ability to produce them in an acceptable time frame. They've probably got full books and don't want to get stuffed around by TfNSW. Maybe they even realised the design was not suitable, and didn't want to be on the receiving end of the complaints.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by boronia »

Merc1107 wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 1:43 pm Are they really Chinese built as the article alleges? If so it's no surprise at all they're having issues. Even if we're averse to Australian-made, there are any number of nations who could surely supply a suitable product.
They were built in China, but to designs and specifications made in Sydney. The order was placed with an Australian company, which should have had oversight of the quality issues. If they had been built in Australia (or any other country for that matter), they would have the same operational problems; maybe Incat didn't want to build them?
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Randomness »

Incat normally does very large express ferries. 3 Emeralds was probably too small of an order for them to justify taking it over the stuff they’re used to building.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by tonyp »

Incat built the first Emeralds but their order books were too full to deliver the second batch in the time required.

The contract for the second batch was given to Birden at Port Macquarie who subcontracted the hulls and basics to Jianglong Shipbuilding, China - just as covid struck, which meant that they couldn't send surveyors to China to supervise the job, hence quite a few shortcomings to fix up back here.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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Mention on Ch 9 tonight that the Feds are tossing in some money for wharves and other infrastructure at La Perouse and Kurnell, to revive the ferry service.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by alleve »

Will the ferry be part of the Sydney Ferries network and take Opal? Or will it be something private? Do we know?
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by Randomness »

In the article,
"The actual schedule would be confirmed by a future operator."
It'll probably be something like the Bundeena ferry based off that, probably with OpalPay though.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by jpp42 »

Captain Cook / Sealink vessel The Jackson Flyer is replacing Me-Mel on the F10 service today. Not sure what this vessel is typically used for, but maybe private transfers /charters - it's configured like a large water taxi with comfortable lounge seats. It must be tricky to find a replacement vessel when Me-Mel is unavailable, due to the small capacity of the Blackwattle Bay (Glebe) wharf.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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https://www.captaincook.com.au/ferry/la ... erry-news/
Lane Cove River Ferry News

16 March 2023

SeaLink Sydney Harbour, the affiliate company of Captain Cook Cruises, was awarded a 15-year extension of the Transport for New South Wales (TfNSW) Lane Cove ferry service in January 2023.

The company, under Captain Cook Cruises, has been proud to operate the Lane Cove River commuter and school ferries since 2006, servicing the communities of Lane Cove, Hunters Hill, Longueville, Northwood, Greenwich, Birchgrove and Balmain.

The highlights of the new contract include

A new timetable commencing 3 April 2023 with an additional peak hour service in the afternoon
Further integration with TfNSW’s Opal payment mechanism improving the overall passenger experience
The new CCLC timetable has not been updated for the Opal changes.
And while I am at there also now timetables for CCSH, CCSH, CCTZ, CCWB and CCWB as from 3rd April while the CCCG timetable finished 2nd April but I have not found a new timetable.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

Post by stupid_girl »

Fleet Lists wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 4:55 pm https://www.captaincook.com.au/ferry/la ... erry-news/
Lane Cove River Ferry News

16 March 2023

SeaLink Sydney Harbour, the affiliate company of Captain Cook Cruises, was awarded a 15-year extension of the Transport for New South Wales (TfNSW) Lane Cove ferry service in January 2023.

The company, under Captain Cook Cruises, has been proud to operate the Lane Cove River commuter and school ferries since 2006, servicing the communities of Lane Cove, Hunters Hill, Longueville, Northwood, Greenwich, Birchgrove and Balmain.

The highlights of the new contract include

A new timetable commencing 3 April 2023 with an additional peak hour service in the afternoon
Further integration with TfNSW’s Opal payment mechanism improving the overall passenger experience
The new CCLC timetable has not been updated for the Opal changes.
And while I am at there also now timetables for CCSH, CCSH, CCTZ, CCWB and CCWB as from 3rd April while the CCCG timetable finished 2nd April but I have not found a new timetable.
A date is not specified for the Opal integration.
My speculation is that it will be done together with Manly Fast Ferry in the mid-year fare hike.
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Re: Ferry Observations 2023

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Manly Fast ferry also starts their new timetable from today
https://www.myfastferry.com.au/2023/03/ ... 1st-april/
New timetable effective from 1st April
March 17, 2023

My Fast Ferry is excited to announce changes to the Manly-Circular Quay fast ferry service timetable, effective from 1st April.

As part of our new agreement with Transport for NSW the updated timetable will enhance the frequency of the service, with an additional 18 weekday and 16 weekend services operating between Manly and Circular Quay.

Fast ferries will depart every 15 minutes during weekday morning and afternoon peak times, and every 20 minutes on weekends.

To better serve our valued passengers, the new timetable will include earlier morning and later evening services on both weekdays and weekends.
Manly Departure Times
Circular Quay Departure Times

These changes will provide greater flexibility and convenience for the local community and visitors alike.

This is just the beginning of My Fast Ferry’s journey under the new 15-year contract with Transport for NSW with further timetable improvements and Opal card integration planned for later this year.
Bus it does state that the Opal integration will take later this year- so I agree that that will probably also apply to Captain Cook above but not necessarily with the mid year fare changes.
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