Hydrogen storage.

General Transport Discussion not specific to one state
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eddy
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Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

As battery cars are heavy and need many thousands of charge points I had this thought.

At every town drive a 3m diameter hole 20m deep then place vertically a 2.5m x 14m plastic tank then temporarily fill the tank with water simultaneously as concrete is placed in the gap with a cap of 6m this can be filled with sufficient liquid green hydrogen storage for 500 cars every time there is a surplus of power with a small hydrogen generator/compressor.
Parrahub, an extra option in the public transport menu http://www.parrahub.org.au/
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eddy
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

Just in case I have stuffed up my calculations
A cylinder 2.5m x 14m has a volume of 275m3 of liquid hydrogen @ 71 kg per m3 = 19,525 kg
The Toyota Mira takes 5kg of hydrogen for 400km and takes 4 minutes to fill so the 19,525 kg tank of liquid hydrogen should fill 4,000 cars.

PS
If NSW puts 100 hydrogen fill points it may be more economical to just deliver the liquid hydrogen to them until it becomes cheaper to generate it on site.
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eddy
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

I wonder if this will really happen https://arena.gov.au/blog/hydrogen-powe ... ownsville/

I went out to Dubbo past the Dish, very funny movie on Netflix, and saw equal numbers of A and B doubles with hardly any singles and that made me think fuel cells are better for trucks than batteries.
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eddy
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

As the Hydrogen tank can fill six times more cars than a petrol tank of the same size it would be a great drawcard for service centres to install one at no charge to the state government.
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moa999
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by moa999 »

Think you need to do some more research.

Per unit of energy compressed hydrogen is 3-4x less dense than petroleum products, though it is lighter - so it takes up more space.
Hence the renders of hydrogen aircraft by Airbus have the back 1/4 or so with no windows.

Secondly due to this compression afaik the tanks need to be above ground for safety and inspection.

Finally when made from electricity (so called green hydrogen when made from renewable sources), it takes about 3x as much electricity to shift an equivalent hydrogen car 100km versus a battery electric one using the best commercial process available.
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eddy
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

moa999 wrote: Mon Jul 18, 2022 1:29 pm Think you need to do some more research.

Per unit of energy compressed hydrogen is 3-4x less dense than petroleum products, though it is lighter - so it takes up more space.
Hence the renders of hydrogen aircraft by Airbus have the back 1/4 or so with no windows.

Secondly due to this compression afaik the tanks need to be above ground for safety and inspection.

Finally when made from electricity (so called green hydrogen when made from renewable sources), it takes about 3x as much electricity to shift an equivalent hydrogen car 100km versus a battery electric one using the best commercial process available.
I am talking about storing liquid hydrogen mate and this is interesting https://www.idealhy.eu/index.php?page=lh2_outline

Why can’t you store liquid hydrogen underground?

I agree it is far better to use power directly but there are times when too much power is made and that is when you can store the hydrogen so the green energy is not at the whim of charging electric cars when it may be raining.

Evidently NSW and Victoria are going to build more fill points https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/news ... east-coast
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eddy
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by eddy »

Although this machine is minimum of 4.5 metres https://www.herrenknecht.com/en/product ... chine-vsm/ perhaps the tank could be a bit wider.

It may cost far more initially than a surface tank but it would be far easier to keep it liquid.
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Myrtone
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Re: Hydrogen storage.

Post by Myrtone »

eddy wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 6:18 pm As battery cars are heavy and need many thousands of charge points...
Additionally, they take time to charge, especially if you look at it as if supercharging did not (yet) exist.
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