Ferry Observations for 2022,

[boronia]

The decision to reintroduce the Freshwaters was purely political. By reintroducing them, the government has neutralised a platform on which their political opponents were going to campaign on. The deal to replace the Freshwaters was done on Constance's watch, it is now up to his predecessors to best manage it.

Well, Gladys was his mentor and has left the fold, so she won't be much help in managing it. I don't think his successors are much better.

[tonyp]

The deal to replace the Freshwaters was done on Constance's watch, it is now up to his *predecessors* to best manage it.

Have you checked whether Scully or Costa want to come out of retirement to do that?

Had Constance been more politically astute, perhaps he would still be the transport minister, rather than reduced to carping from the sidelines having overestimated his electoral appeal and brought about his own political demise. The overseas made junk from Tasmania that Constance refers to in his tweet was actually built in China. Good to see he is on top of things. Only one of the 10 trips is a peak-hour service, the 17:31 the Circular Quay. Should there be demand, it is more likely to be in the off-peak.

The tweet is obviously a tit-for-tat response,to David Elliott and Rob Stokes who pointed out Constance's naivety in suggesting Sydney would have a 100% electric bus fleet by 2030 earlier in the day.

Constance came extremely close in the Gilmore vote. His greatest support came from the bushfire-affected areas, contrary to the narrative of the left that the Liberals bungled the bushfires. The Labor candidate scraped in on the votes of the nowadays typically urban Labor constituencies - Kiama (the rich) and Nowra (Centrelink customers).

I'm not a fan of Constance, but Australian industry didn't have the capacity to build the unprecedented volume of transport stock that the Coalition acquired during a mere ten years. And the electric bus statement by Constance was meant to be a challenge, not taken literally. The next step after that was to set up a unit in Transport, consult with manufacturers and operators and come up with a detailed timeframe, which is what has happened and announced 2 1/2 months ago. The ABC and SMH have just caught up with the story and, as usual, turned it into a scandal.

[Linto63]

Have you checked whether Scully or Costa want to come out of retirement to do that?

My bad; successor, not predecessor.

Constance came extremely close in the Gilmore vote. His greatest support came from the bushfire-affected areas, contrary to the narrative of the left that the Liberals bungled the bushfires. The Labor candidate scraped in on the votes of the nowadays typically urban Labor constituencies - Kiama (the rich) and Nowra (Centrelink customers).

Fact remains that he was the architect of his own demise.

And the electric bus statement by Constance was meant to be a challenge, not taken literally.

More likely was one of those of those off the cuff announcements that Constance often made without consulting his department first.

The ABC and SMH have just caught up with the story and, as usual, turned it into a scandal.

The news may be a couple of months old, but it was within the past week that Elliott and Stokes made their comments about the timeline Constance set being unrealistic, hence why it was picked up by the media. Either way governments shouldn't be setting targets that it can realistically achieve, 2030 was doomed to fail from the start.

[tonyp]

The news may be a couple of months old, but it was within the past week that Elliott and Stokes made their comments about the timeline Constance set being unrealistic, hence why it was picked up by the media. Either way governments shouldn't be setting targets that it can realistically achieve, 2030 was doomed to fail from the start.

I doubt that Elliott and Stokes would have phrased it in this way. The issue is the way these two media outlets have turned it into a negative, ignoring the fact that NSW was the first state to initiate bus electrification in a major way. Constance started it as a challenge and blind freddy should know that the next step was for bureaucracy to start the analysis and programming, including consultation with stakeholders, then set up a firm program and refined timeline. But of course there's an election coming up and the ABC and SMH are angling for any dirt they can throw on the government.

[boronia]

Getting off track here? This is the Ferry Observation thread,

[Linto63]

Agreed, have moved my reply to the more appropriate NSW Electric Bus Plan thread.

[lunchbox]

"MARY REIBY"
This vessel is not equipped with destination signs. The company operating the Parramatta River ferry services, Transdev, says it's because it's a "chartered" vessel. I doubt bus operators would be allowed, these days, to operate "chartered" buses on route services without some kind of destination sign. Why does Transport for NSW (TfNSW) allow Transdev to "get away with it" on ferries?
Once again, TfNSW appears to be slack in its contract administration. If you think I'm accumulating black marks against TfNSW, you're right. Its public face appears to be an internet shopfront staffed by public relations bulldust propagators.
Bring on the March 2023 election, and hopefuly, a new-broom Minister.
10273

[boronia]

Why do you need destination signs on a ferry? The wharves have PIDs and DVAs indicating where the next ferry is going.

Passengers survived for over 100 years without them.

[Jurassic_Joke]

Had my first ride on the Emerald Class ferries made specifically for the F1 Manly service.

I rode late at night when it was quiet. I sat on the upper outside deck out the front. I thought it was still pretty nice - you still get a good view from there, although far less seats here than on the Freshwater (on the Emeralds its a single long bench), I can already see on summer days this area will get uncomfortably crowded. What I did find annoying was the lighting from the interior + the lighting from the large destination board immediately above where you’re sitting was a bit much, on the Freshwaters the front outdoor space on the top deck is a lot larger and you can (choose to) sit in complete darkness if you prefer. Back to the Emerald’s, walking through the interior to get to the top outside area, I thought the interior of these new ferries looks nice and modern and cosy enough.

Definitely far better than the River Cats, really not a fan of those

[lunchbox]

^^^^boronia, Friday Sept 9 - I explained in detail to TfNSW why destos are required on ferries. I didn't think I would need to explain it to participants on this forum, so I won't.
10387

[Fleet Lists]

But you have not explained it to us.
I agree with Boronia.

[boronia]

^^^lunchbox, so why did you bother posting it here in the first place?

[lunchbox]

MARY REIBY.
The primary purpose of my Sept.9, 2022 post (above) was to again alert readers to my increasing concerns regarding this state's primary transport agency, Transport for NSW, its failings, and the unsatisfactory way in which it deals with complaints from the public.
Since you ask, the reasons why I think Parramatta River ferries need external on-board destination indicators include -
- CONFIRMATION of other available information, which waiting passengers may or may not have gleaned,
- CONSISTENCY across the fleet,
- some passengers, like tourists, wouldn't even know which direction, i.e. up or down river, they needed to travel, (which I have personally experienced),
- verbal announcements by crew, few as they are, are too often drowned out by noise from the ferry's engine or other extraneous noise,
- in peak hours, ferries having varying destinations and stopping patterns can arrive at the wharf closely separated, and out-of-timetable order, causing confusion.
10538

[Linto63]

As previously stated, every wharf has a PID. Failing that, and every ferry has a crew who generally announce where it is headed. If anybody is still in doubt, they can just ask. As far as problems with out transport network, this is small beer.

[Fleet Lists]

MARY REIBY.
The primary purpose of my Sept.9, 2022 post (above) was to again alert readers to my increasing concerns regarding this state's primary transport agency, Transport for NSW, its failings, and the unsatisfactory way in which it deals with complaints from the public.
Since you ask, the reasons why I think Parramatta River ferries need external on-board destination indicators include -
- CONFIRMATION of other available information, which waiting passengers may or may not have gleaned,
- CONSISTENCY across the fleet,
- some passengers, like tourists, wouldn't even know which direction, i.e. up or down river, they needed to travel, (which I have personally experienced),
- verbal announcements by crew, few as they are, are too often drowned out by noise from the ferry's engine or other extraneous noise,
- in peak hours, ferries having varying destinations and stopping patterns can arrive at the wharf closely separated, and out-of-timetable order, causing confusion.
10538

What would you prefer - No ferry or a ferry without a destination sign?

[boronia]

Seems the F1 is running to weekday frequencies from this weekend. 20 min Emeralds, 2 hour Freshwater.

[Fleet Lists]

Yes that seems to be as per timetable - I had missed that.

[boronia]

I was around CQ this afternoon, so I watched the 1330 Emerald and 1331 Freshwater departures. Balmoral arrived at the wharf about 1320, but the staff opened the gangway to the Freshwater and directed all the waiting passengers to catch that instead.

So much for the STMF conspiracy theory that Transdev were deliberately stopping passengers from riding on it.

[boronia]

Manly ferries removed from service after steering failure near cruise ship

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/man ... 5bl6m.html

[Merc1107]

It seems that no transport mode in Sydney is safe from being embroiled in some catastrophic debacle or another right now.

[tonyp]

Manly ferries removed from service after steering failure near cruise ship

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/man ... 5bl6m.html

The Herald will get its usual mileage out of this, totally ignoring the major teething problems the Freshwaters had when they came into service. One of the Freshwaters ended up on Manly Beach due to a control system failure. New vehicles and vessels can have running in issues.

[Linto63]

Bit like the SMH's ongoing campaign of negativity towards electric buses that you told us it had, having run a grand total of two stories. The story isn't a hatchet job, but a reporting of what has happened, inconvenient as some may find it. That the Fairlights have had a litany of problems isn't a media driven conspiracy theory, but a fact.

The SMH did report on the Freshwater's teething problems, the Manly grounding being on page 1 on 11 March 1983.

[tonyp]

Bit like the SMH's ongoing campaign of negativity towards electric buses that you told us it had, having run a grand total of two stories. The story isn't a hatchet job, but a reporting of what has happened, inconvenient as some may find it. That the Fairlights have had a litany of problems isn't a media driven conspiracy theory, but a fact.

The SMH did report on the Freshwater's teething problems, the Manly grounding being on page 1 on 11 March 1983.

If it had done its job fairly, the Herald would recognise that new vessels can have running in issues as the Freshwaters did, but it's on an election campaign so it won't.

[Aurora]

Well, it would be objective to provide this context, but I would hazard a guess that the reporter probably doesn’t even know.

[Linto63]

If it had done its job fairly, the Herald would recognise that new vessels can have running in issues as the Freshwaters did, but it's on an election campaign so it won't.

So when the SMH report something it is sensationalising or with an agenda yet when News Corp run stories like More than 20 cracks found in new Manly to Circular Quay ferry and Waratah trains still bugged by problems that is responsible journalism?

Many transport items that go on to have successful careers have teething problems and rather public failures, doesn't mean they aren't newsworthy much as the government of the day would prefer they were swept under the carpet.