NSW Electric Bus Plan

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Linto63
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Linto63 »

tonyp wrote: Nexport must be thanking its lucky stars that its badging didn't seem to leak out, nor news of the Chinese underpinnings of the bus.
The Mercedes-Benz Citaro was regularly front page news in its early years due to its regular ability to catch fire. Yet it went on to become the most sold bus of all time. Yesterday's incident is unlikely to cause Nexport much, if any, reputational damage, particularly as it appears it was user rather than manufacturer error.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Merc1107 »

Linto63 wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 9:40 am The Mercedes-Benz Citaro was regularly front page news in its early years due to its regular ability to catch fire. Yet it went on to become the most sold bus of all time. Yesterday's incident is unlikely to cause Nexport much, if any, reputational damage, particularly as it appears it was user rather than manufacturer error.
Is it necessary to be contrary on absolutely every point?
Running out of fuel is rather a lot different to catching fire.

Some of the MB offerings here in Australia have had issues with fires. Perth threatened legal action last decade over it. This alone won't have precipitated the circumstances leading to MB halting sales in Australia recently, but I suspect the reputational damage would be hard to shake.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Linto63 »

Merc1107 wrote: Is it necessary to be contrary on absolutely every point?
Unless I didn't get the memo, I was under the impression this was an internet forum where people can offer alternative views.
Merc1107 wrote: Running out of fuel is rather a lot different to catching fire.
Of course it is, so if a manufacturer can overcome this, then any reputational damage Nexport might have incurred, would have been minimal.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by alleve »

Merc1107 wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:22 am Is it necessary to be contrary on absolutely every point?
It is when you fundamentally disagree with the point being made.

There wouldn't be much of a conversation if everyone decided to stay silent the moment they're confronted with any opinion or idea.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by boronia »

tonyp wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 11:36 pm Just for the record, this was reported widely across the media, including the SMH and ABC, so there goes the Murdoch conspiracy. Nexport must be thanking its lucky stars that its badging didn't seem to leak out, nor news of the Chinese underpinnings of the bus. The replacement was a CDC Brazilian Irizar.

Personally, I don't think this episode really reflects on battery buses per se. Considering it was on a pretty tame run around Sydney's western and SW suburbs, it looks more like somebody got their charging calculations badly wrong and maybe also it didn't make enough use of the regen. A year or so back, an Element was driven from Brisbane to Gold Coast, ran a few demos and then back to Brisbane on one charge. But then the Element is a much better bus - and Australian.
In one report I saw today, the driver virtually admitted he "forgot to recharge it". They might equally have had to admit that they "forgot to refuel" a diesel bus.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Swift »

I don't get it. I would be more on the side of paranoia on making sure it's charged for such a long trip.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Merc1107 »

Linto63 wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 1:23 pmUnless I didn't get the memo, I was under the impression this was an internet forum where people can offer alternative views.
alleve wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 2:12 pmIt is when you fundamentally disagree with the point being made.

There wouldn't be much of a conversation if everyone decided to stay silent the moment they're confronted with any opinion or idea.
Of course, everyone is allowed to offering their perspective; it's nice that ATDB, quiet as it these days, is not an echo-chamber. However, there is a difference between disagreement and engaging in conduct that could be construed as splitting hairs.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Linto63 »

I don't really see how my post could be conscrewed as splitting hairs. But if you find mine or anybody else's posts annoying, contrary, engaging in conduct that could be construed as splitting hairs, ill-informed, tedious or whatever else, suggest beneath your name in the top right hand corner going to User Control Panel / Friends & Foes / Manage foes and add the relevant members. Then their posts will bother you no more. Having responded to some of your queries on occasions, I will refrain from doing so going forward.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Fleet Lists »

End of that discussion.

Back on subject please,
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by ScaniaGrenda »

Do we possibly have any further insight or information into the supposed Electric Bus from New Zealand still possibly being in the Hunter Valley Region? Last post I believe noted it was in Branxton (well near there @ Elderslie). I'm not too familiar with the area or even Branxton itself but doesn't seem to be too much around there and I haven't personally spotted it to date, not even in Cessnock, Singleton or Maitland so rather curious as to whether It's still hanging around or has it moved on?

I'd wonder why this is so hush hush as well and why no one not even the manufacturer has said anything with it.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by LB608 »

I will check with my 96 year friend from Bulwarra
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by LB608 »

Here we go,it was a pro - 0 -type, it did operate in Scone for 1 day it took workers from Scone to factory just outside of Scone,but proved useless.
It then moved to Bruce Moore at Elderslie, he owns a 6 seater plane. the bus spends it's nights in the hanger with the plane, the bus was running,3 days a week from Elderslie to Belford/Lower Belford, to a sheep station (his words not mine), there a very steep hill from the Elderslie bridge towards Branxton, the bus struggled to get up the hill.
It runns on two strings which together have a capacity of 210kWhi,only offers arange of 200km,was equipped for rapid charging.
It is on it's way back to N Z
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by Swift »

Importing an EV bus for a few operators from the sticks to try it out? Ultra unusual.
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by tonyp »

LB608 wrote: Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:05 pm Here we go,it was a pro - 0 -type, it did operate in Scone for 1 day it took workers from Scone to factory just outside of Scone,but proved useless.
It then moved to Bruce Moore at Elderslie, he owns a 6 seater plane. the bus spends it's nights in the hanger with the plane, the bus was running,3 days a week from Elderslie to Belford/Lower Belford, to a sheep station (his words not mine), there a very steep hill from the Elderslie bridge towards Branxton, the bus struggled to get up the hill.
It runns on two strings which together have a capacity of 210kWhi,only offers arange of 200km,was equipped for rapid charging.
It is on it's way back to N Z
Any more details on the bus, like a photo, or its manufacturer?
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

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The guy is 96,so i am happy with the information he gave me
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Re: NSW Electric Bus Plan

Post by ScaniaGrenda »

Thanks for the further insight information LB608, being in the stage of a prototype vehicle I guess It isn't really any surprise that information on it is very tight-lipped from those in the proper know how of it (manufacturer).

none of us are certain what it really was however NZ doesn't really have too big of a bus building industry & for all we know it may not have been the speculated Zemtec, perhaps something else entirely. Still a bit odd they pick the middle of nowhere regional Australia to basically test it but again that's how information & research is gathered so maybe chances are whoever this is or was is intending to possibly market their vehicle(s) here in the future at some point.

As LB pointed out, it didn't work out too well on the hills so perhaps this is more tweaking that is needed.

Since it's going back to NZ perhaps we may hear something from one of the enthuistists over there once it arrives back in due time.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

Post by alleve »

I live in region 6 and catch buses in it almost every day, and I can say there's a noticeable improvement over State Transit. The buses are always clean and well maintained, there's never graffiti, they're always on time, and most of the services out of Tempe are run by the B7 and B8RLEs so you get new buses all the time. I've also been seeing Leichardt's BYDs running on Sundays now.

My mates who live in region 9 have had the opposite experience. The Elements are never out, so it's always an old graffitied dirty CB60 with scratches on the windows, always late and always full. Broken stop buttons seem to be common. And to my knowledge, Transdev hasn't ordered any new buses for the East after taking it over, despite the Oranas reaching their 25 year use by. One of my friends will regularly walk 40 minutes to the Light Rail instead of catch his local bus to Randwick because Transdev is so inconsistent he doesn't trust the bus to turn up at all.

So I'm not really that upset about Transit Systems gaining so much territory this time round. I have barely any experience with Interline and Busabout but my experience with Transit Systems is very positive.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

Post by tonyp »

The region 9 Elements are regularly on 350 where their low floor is doubtless appreciated by airport users. Otherwise it appears pretty random which route they're on.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

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In reply to alleve
You must be lucky as Transit Systems also still has 11 Ansair Orana's just at Tempe and 45 overall. Their "new" bus were all acquired before 2022 so again no new buses have been ordered during the period you mention for region 9.

In fact there has been a freeze on new buses in Sydney since the move to electric buses - we are still waiting for the electric bus plan which was announced some time ago, to start. The exception has been Transit Systems Leichhardt which has been the only depot in Sydney to have received a decent number of electric buses.

As far as the 25 year rule is concerned, there is nothing the operators can do about as they can not order new buses to replace the older ones.

The 25 year rule was included in the previous contracts but it has not been confirmed that such a rule is still present in the new contracts.

It will be interesting to see what the new minister is going to do about this lack of new buses being made available to operators.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

Post by Linto63 »

Word is that with Transit Systems about to receive a large injection of new buses which will significantly reduce its average fleet age, that rather than retiring its oldest buses, it will be releasing some mid-life buses to other operators.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

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alleve wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 9:29 am I live in region 6 and catch buses in it almost every day, and I can say there's a noticeable improvement over State Transit. The buses are always clean and well maintained, there's never graffiti, they're always on time, and most of the services out of Tempe are run by the B7 and B8RLEs so you get new buses all the time. I've also been seeing Leichardt's BYDs running on Sundays now.

My mates who live in region 9 have had the opposite experience. The Elements are never out, so it's always an old graffitied dirty CB60 with scratches on the windows, always late and always full. Broken stop buttons seem to be common. And to my knowledge, Transdev hasn't ordered any new buses for the East after taking it over, despite the Oranas reaching their 25 year use by. One of my friends will regularly walk 40 minutes to the Light Rail instead of catch his local bus to Randwick because Transdev is so inconsistent he doesn't trust the bus to turn up at all.

So I'm not really that upset about Transit Systems gaining so much territory this time round. I have barely any experience with Interline and Busabout but my experience with Transit Systems is very positive.
Transit Systems did have a few teething issues with the T80 in 2013 after it got placed in the region 3 contract which saw Western Sydney buses the STA's Liverpool-Parramatta t way operations get privatised. Busabout is a ok operator and Interline is also a ok operator so I'm looking forward to what Transit Systems can do in the Liverpool Campbelltown and Camden areas
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

Post by alleve »

tonyp wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:03 am The region 9 Elements are regularly on 350 where their low floor is doubtless appreciated by airport users. Otherwise it appears pretty random which route they're on.
I've also seen them on the 324 a couple times, but it's rare. Looking on anytrip it's common for only one or two Elements to be out at a time, if any at all.
Fleet Lists wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:21 am In reply to alleve
You must be lucky as Transit Systems also still has 11 Ansair Orana's just at Tempe and 45 overall ... It will be interesting to see what the new minister is going to do about this lack of new buses being made available to operators.
The Tempe Oranas are rarely ever seen, I've caught them maybe 3 times in the last 6 months, and they usually only make it out at school times. I would say maybe 2/3 to 3/4 of the time I catch the bus it's an Optimus. I'm not sure if I'm lucky, or if Transit Systems has some positive bias towards the 476/477. Interesting point about operators not being able to buy new buses, I didn't think about that. One would hope that the new minister allows artics again and pushes for hybrids in the regional areas.
Linto63 wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:29 am Word is that with Transit Systems about to receive a large injection of new buses which will significantly reduce its average fleet age, that rather than retiring its oldest buses, it will be releasing some mid-life buses to other operators.
Is that just the 79 Elements, or will there be more? I know that the Govt plans on fully electrifying Tempe and putting some 180 electrics into Leichardt and Kingsgrove.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

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Linto63 wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:29 am Word is that with Transit Systems about to receive a large injection of new buses which will significantly reduce its average fleet age, that rather than retiring its oldest buses, it will be releasing some mid-life buses to other operators.
Electric Buses - that is where at the moment Transit Systems has the advantage with Leichhardt the only depot network wide that is capable of having a large volume of electric buses.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

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Is that just the 79 Elements, or will there be more? I know that the Govt plans on fully electrifying Tempe and putting some 180 electrics into Leichardt and Kingsgrove.
Yes Tempe is also included in the plan but it may not be next depot to be done as the plan includes depots of other oprators such as Taren Point, Menai (moving from Transdev to the new region 10 operator) and others.
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Re: 2023 NSW Election

Post by J_Busworth »

alleve wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 12:46 pm The Tempe Oranas are rarely ever seen, I've caught them maybe 3 times in the last 6 months, and they usually only make it out at school times. I would say maybe 2/3 to 3/4 of the time I catch the bus it's an Optimus. I'm not sure if I'm lucky, or if Transit Systems has some positive bias towards the 476/477. Interesting point about operators not being able to buy new buses, I didn't think about that. One would hope that the new minister allows artics again and pushes for hybrids in the regional areas.
The Tempe Oranas operate every weekday. Some examples: At 1pm today there were 5 of the 11 out in service across the 303, 308, 422 and 430. Last Friday at between 4pm and 5pm I got photos of 6 of the 11 passing Sydenham Station on 358, 418 and 430 trips. I see them out in service on the 303/348/358 going past UNSW, and it would be an oddity if there wasn't at least a few Orana operated trips throughout the day.

Perhaps the longer shift lengths or the all day shifts with breaks at Rockdale Meal Room on the Bayside runs (476/7/8/9) are more suited to newer buses.

Tempe certainly isn't the focus on electrifying either. Kingsgrove has just gone electric with the delivery of the first Element there today (although there would be around 20 of them awaiting entry to service at AMD). Burwood is next.
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