New Intercity Fleet Purchases/Observation

[RayW]

As usual the wife corrected me. She said that the service back then was 8;21 from Central, arriving at Newcastle at 10:55. Dang, I always felt that was much shorter a trip.

Now with the new fleet and this is interesting: wasn't there a comment recently from one of the people in Macquarie street that all these overseas sourced purchases was now under review?

[RayW]

I think the sign board says it all.

[tonyp]

The record time for Sydney-Newcastle is 2 hrs 1 minute, achieved with a 38 class hauled special trip which ran non stop from Central to Newcastle under very controlled conditions. Am empty XPT set may have achieved similar timings. Sorry, bu no way your trip could have been under 2 hours.

I went on a special XPT trip in the 1980s that set out to beat this record, but I think it didn't succeed by a few minutes iirc.

[Fleet Lists]

Various posts have been reported as off topic. I have given them the benefit of the doubt. However this history discussion is now closed and future posts should be back on topic.

Any further off topic posts will be deleted.

[boronia]

It's 160 km/h but NSW Trains have already said that they will be run to existing schedules. No speeding up of services.

Until the digital signalling upgrade and ATO is completed, which will allow higher speeds and improved acceleration/deceleration performance. The same goes for the Waratahs, Millenniums and Oscars, which have a maximum design speed of 130km/h.

Will that extend beyond the metro area? Hard to see the need with intercity frequencies. If it does, I imagine would be years away

[Transtopic]

Until the digital signalling upgrade and ATO is completed, which will allow higher speeds and improved acceleration/deceleration performance. The same goes for the Waratahs, Millenniums and Oscars, which have a maximum design speed of 130km/h.

Will that extend beyond the metro area? Hard to see the need with intercity frequencies. If it does, I imagine would be years away

I believe that it will eventually be extended across the whole electrified network and will be compatible with the existing ATP (ETCS - Level 1) which is nearing completion. Compatibility will enable ETCS - Level 2 and ATO to be extended in stages and lineside signalling will be progressively removed. Freight train locomotives and regional train fleets will also be equipped with in-cab signalling. It appears that infrequent users such as heritage steam trains will have portable in-cab devices which will enable drivers to monitor signalling but they won't have the capability of ATP or ATO for obvious reasons.

[MotorOmnibus8562]

Sets D30/D130 appear to be on their way:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEuw-iigvo0

[Swift]

The tradition is being kept in having an interurban counterpart to a suburban set. First was the silver U sets that had a resemblance to the red sets, then the V sets being the counterpart to the S sets, the Oscars being the counterpart to the M sets and now the D sets being an interurban waratah.

[Frodo]

D sets have been listed on several CCN runs for next Monday on real time apps - time will tell whether they will actually be running

[BAMBAM]

D sets have been listed on several CCN runs for next Monday on real time apps - time will tell whether they will actually be running

No NIF trains are running on the network. Mainly because:

1. With ongoing industrial action and no resolution on how to operate the NIF train with guard or not, no testing will be permitted until that is resolved.

2. Signallers and/or Network Controllers won’t authorise any movement for NIF trains unless it’s delivery runs or movements to yards or sidings if towed by a Freight Train, not driven by and Crew.

[Swift]

Vs get a reprieve.

[BAMBAM]

Vs get a reprieve.

You’ll be in for a treat, even if everything gets resolved there’s still training to do for all current staff, so they’ll be here for the next couple of years easily.

Also the longer this takes, the longer Oscars are kept on Intercity duties the longer K Sets continue to survive as the intention was to release Oscars to Suburban working and replacing K Sets.

Silver set fleet remaining strong well past their used by dates

[Swift]

Got to get out there and film.

[Glen]

The tradition is being kept in having an interurban counterpart to a suburban set. First was the silver U sets that had a resemblance to the red sets, then the V sets being the counterpart to the S sets, the Oscars being the counterpart to the M sets and now the D sets being an interurban waratah.

Whatever you do don't tell tonyp you are aligning V sets with S sets.

U-boats and Sputniks he could probably handle.

[tonyp]

Whatever you do don't tell tonyp you are aligning V sets with S sets.

U-boats and Sputniks he could probably handle.

I can see the analogy that Swiftie is trying to draw, but the Us and Vs had their doors at the carriage ends like a country train, whereas the H and D follows the layout of a suburban set, one of the main reasons they are (Hs) and are going to be (Ds) a lousy long journey-time train. Certainly the Us had some of the design cues of the standard suburban sets though. The factor that I would nominate as being common to the S (the Comeng one, not the Goninan rubbish) and the V is that they were the last good trains ever designed and built for the suburban and interurban systems. Comeng knew how to design and build a good double deck train.

I suspect that there's a good chance that the XPT may well turn out to be our best country train.

[RayW]

Comeng had a policy of over engineering things. Take for example the under frames on the K and V sets, some of the gusset welds were 30mm. We should follow the Yanks, or at least the New Yorkers. Some of their underground sets are near 60 years old. They don't throw out good trains, they simply rebuild them. The V sets in theory could go for another 20 years or more with some re-engineering. I know, I did my apprenticeship there.

[Swift]

I saw an artists impression of a heavily refurbished V set interior modified for wheelchair accessibility. Looked like it belonged in the 21st century. They were ahead of their time.
We tend to do refurbishment on the cheap here. If we did it to the level of London Underground with their 73 stock and others which took 30 years off them, there would be no need for these D sets. NSW just has to exhibit the next big thing to woo voters, not for genuine need to modernize.

[Linto63]

Th V sets were a great train in their day, but everything reaches a used by date. You can refurbish trains until the underframes collapse, but 30-40 years is the normal economic life for EMU stock and the V sets are in that window now.

[Swift]

Greater than an Oscar now. Ever sat in both for an hour plus? Reversible seats standard in the 1970 U sets. Not available in 2022.

[boronia]

I can see the analogy that Swiftie is trying to draw, but the Us and Vs had their doors at the carriage ends like a country train, whereas the H and D follows the layout of a suburban set, one of the main reasons they are (Hs) and are going to be (Ds) a lousy long journey-time train. Certainly the Us had some of the design cues of the standard suburban sets though. The factor that I would nominate as being common to the S (the Comeng one, not the Goninan rubbish) and the V is that they were the last good trains ever designed and built for the suburban and interurban systems. Comeng knew how to design and build a good double deck train.

I suspect that there's a good chance that the XPT may well turn out to be our best country train.

No doubt this is part of a plan to have standard lengths and door positions to facilitate future introduction of platform doors.

[boronia]

I saw an artists impression of a heavily refurbished V set interior modified for wheelchair accessibility. Looked like it belonged in the 21st century. They were ahead of their time.

Did it include a DDA compliant toilet?

[MotorOmnibus8562]

I saw an artists impression of a heavily refurbished V set interior modified for wheelchair accessibility. Looked like it belonged in the 21st century. They were ahead of their time.

Did it include a DDA compliant toilet?

I highly doubt it, as the V sets don't really have a lot of space for the toilet, they'd have to remove a couple of seats to put a DDA Compliant toilet in the transition area but even then there wouldn't be space for wheelchairs as the V sets structure was built during a time when the DDA wasn't a thing. H sets were built with DDA requirements so an accessible toilet has been included

[hornetfig]

2. Signallers and/or Network Controllers won’t authorise any movement for NIF trains unless it’s delivery runs or movements to yards or sidings if towed by a Freight Train, not driven by and Crew.

Doesn't that constitute an unprotected secondary boycott?

[pgt]

As much as the V sets are nice, having had a ride of them a couple of times in the last month they were definitely starting to show their age a bit.

Not that I've looked too hard but what sort of seats are inside these new NIF trains... as long as they're not as hard as those on the Queensland NGR sets that they use between the Gold Coast and Brisbane (which I had to travel last week), it'll be an improvement.
(Think "ironing board"... heck the seat back even looked like one - and none of this at-seat power or other fanciness).

[Swift]

As much as the V sets are nice, having had a ride of them a couple of times in the last month they were definitely starting to show their age a bit.

Not their true age of over half a century. People in 1977 with the much improved second series must have been gobsmacked at the new standard before them. More modern than any of the cars Australia was producing at the time except maybe the locally assembled mark IV Ford Cortina.
The D sets do look nice externally I think.