FAGEOL Buses - First Co. To Build a Bus From The Ground Up

chevinoz · Post by **chevinoz** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:03 pm

A great paddock find by way of an early 30's Fageol Bus was listed on eBay recently, this prompted me too look into them a little further and I was surprised to find they had a bit of deep history in Australia.

Fageol_Bus_eBay.JPG

Those of you who have already read my thread in the 'Buses For Sale' section please excuse this rehash, but I thought this bit of history might also interest those members that don't read the classifieds.

Quoting from Wikipedia re Fageol:

The company was founded in 1916 to manufacture motor trucks, farm tractors and automobiles in Oakland, California.[1]

In 1921, it became the first company to build a bus from the ground up. This new bus was called the "Safety Bus". The goal was to build a bus that was not prone to overturning when cornering. It had a wide track, and was lower to the ground to ensure the passengers' safety and ease of entry and exit. Following shortly after the success of the Safety Bus was the larger 22-seat "Safety Coach".[2] The factory was located in Oakland, California, but did not survive the depression of the early 1930s. It went into receivership, and the bank assumed control and re-organized under the name Fageol Truck and Coach. In 1938, Mr. Peterman bought the factory and its contents. Shortly, the first Peterbilt was produced.

The Fageol brothers left the company in 1927 to form a the Twin Coach Company, manufacturing buses in Kent, Ohio.

The South Australian Railways (SAR) operated a number of Fageol buses and trucks. In 1932 they introduced into service the first of four railcars converted from their road buses. These vehicles initially operated on the SAR 3-foot-6-inch (1.07 m) gauge Port Lincoln Division, however some were transferred to the South East Division branch line to Kingston, South Australia, prior to the line's conversion to broad gauge. The last railcar was condemned in 1961.[3]

SA_Rail_Fageol_Rail_Car.jpg

Even the Victorian Railways had a Fageol connection.

Vic_Rail_Fageol.jpg

I absolutely love looking at B&W photography from the early days, it somehow brings the subject matter to life.

The Fageol brothers definately had a vision way beyond their era, they went on to be one of the few firms to produce Liquified Petroleum Gas (Propane) buses in the 1950s.

Hope this little insight has been of interest to my fellow history buffs out there. Cheers, Phil.

Car177 · Post by **Car177** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 1:06 am

That bus would be ex Hornibrook Hwy B.S. Ltd. No 13, it and another came from Cribb Is B.S. during the war, previous history unknown.

Dave Wilson · Post by **Dave Wilson** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:50 pm

This Fageol bears a remarkable resemblance to one of the Glenister and McKenzie buses. G & M ran a Parramtta-Sydney service and a Drummoyne - Sydney but were put out of business in 1931. The Company's Fageol fleet passed to the DRTT and were sold off by 1936.Some are known to have gone to Brisbane via auction, so this may well be one of them. It appears to have been modified, or 'modernised', to be more precise, by it's QLD operators. Attached is what it may have looked like at Glenister and McKenzie.

It would be very interesting to know if this Fageol discovery has DRTT connections. Another early Sydney Government bus would be wonderful to have.

chevinoz · Post by **chevinoz** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:12 pm

Dave Wilson wrote: It would be very interesting to know if this Fageol discovery has DRTT connections. Another early Sydney Government bus would be wonderful to have.

Thanks for your contribution Dave, it definately has the same roofline as the one in your pic, you might be onto something there. If you wanted to follow it up the chap who owns it may be able to shed some light, the person who listed it said the chap "has a dislike of computers", this being the case he may have a few years under his belt and might know a bit about the old girl. The contact number supplied is (08)85874334.

Cheers, Phil.

Car177 · Post by **Car177** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 8:42 pm

HHBS operated 3 Fageols, 13 & 16 bought from the Cribb Is Bus Service of Brisbane during the war and 17 which was bought as a chassis and bodied by HHBS.
Cribb Is sold the buses because of their high fuel costs, HHBS were running a shorter and more profitable route.
The HHBS Fageols were said to have had a division inside the bus to give a second seating area, also fitted for a short time with sirens to indicate their departure from Scarborough.
The pictured bus 13 is the bus for sale on E Bay and was sold from service in the early 50's for use in drilling or dam sinking work.
The two attached photos were supplied by the late Arthur Narracott many years ago, he is the shorter of the bus company staff.
The picture shows 3 conductors and a driver (on the right) outside the Sandgate Station in the early post war years, during the war HHBS employed teenagers as conductors.
The present owner of the bus acquired it with the purchase of the property on which it stands, he is unaware of its past history other than the fact that the previous owner had it there for many years.
It would be great if the museum could acquire this vehicle.

Dave Wilson · Post by **Dave Wilson** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 1:19 pm

Car177 wrote:HHBS operated 3 Fageols, 13 & 16 bought from the Cribb Is Bus Service

Do you have a picture of No 16 by any chance?? Would be interesting to compare the bodies.

Car177 · Post by **Car177** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:41 pm

No I don't, it couldn't have lasted long as there was a second No. 16 built about 1945, a Hedges built steel body on a LHD White WA20, the third Fageol No.17 came as a chassis only and was first body fully built by HHBS, there is always the chance it could have been the chassis of No.16.

Dave Wilson · Post by **Dave Wilson** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:01 pm

It seems odd that this bus ended up where it is. Makes you wonder whether a local operator had it first and further begs the question whether there may be others in the area. Red and White's three axle Thornycroft for instance

Car177 · Post by **Car177** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 10:09 pm

I stated in a previous post what the bus was sold for, I learned this about 20 years ago from fellows who had driven it.
It is surprising what is lieing out there, 20 years ago I started looking for local buses that had been onsold and ended up finding quite a few,3 Shuttlewood Leyland Comets in the Gloucester area, a Hedges Comet near Miles Qld,A Hope Morris in the Ipswich area and a Gardiner bodied White (body only) in a wreckers yard in Toowoomba,and other later ones, they are out there, it just takes knowledge to realise what they are.
The Thornycroft, read about it again yesterday in Travers book, he said sold to Red and White in Brisbane, most people would think Cribb Island but more likely the Red and White at Ipswich.

chevinoz · Post by **chevinoz** » Mon Dec 21, 2009 6:25 pm

Great contribution "Car177", there is one heck of a knowledge base amongst our members, I really didn't expect someone to have such detailed info on such a vintage "paddock find". You've gotta love this board!

Car177 · Post by **Car177** » Mon Dec 21, 2009 8:51 pm

I would have liked to have learned more but it is a long gone bus, over 80 years old and off the road for 50 years, I have been on the trail of this one for years.

Dave Wilson · Post by **Dave Wilson** » Mon Dec 21, 2009 10:04 pm

I actually had an old postcard which showed the Thornycroft at North Quay, Brisbane. Probably late 1940s. It was a little distant in a streetscene, but you could tell that it was it. Can't find the damn card now.

alburybuses · Post by **alburybuses** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:37 pm

An usual vehicle. What was their origin, sounds French or Dutch ?
I understand Peter Anderson P.O. Box 35 Deepwater NSW 2371 has information on the FAGEOL bus. Unfortunately he isnt a computer 'freak', so it's all snail-mail. He often advertises in the Classies of Restored Cars, Australian Classic Car and the like.

GM · Post by GM » Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:26 pm

Glenister & Mackenzie were the agents for the Fageol Motors Co.
A little information on G & M & Fageol. GM

Bus Service Changes Hands
----------------------------------------
The well-known Fageol Bus Service, until recently carried on by Sydney Safety Coaches, Ltd., has been purchased by Messrs, Glenister and MacKenzie Fageol Ltd., of 25 O'Connell Street, Sydney who will at once recondition the whole of the buses and put new vehicles into commission at the earliest possible date.
Messrs, Glenister and MacKenzie Fageol Ltd., are the New South Wales and Queensland Agents for Fageol Motors Company, and will still conduct their agency business from 25 O'Connell Street, Sydney.
It is the new owners intention to bring the Parramatta service right up to its full timetable, and they have given the Traffic Department definite assurances as to the future conduct of the service. Mr. S. A Glenister, the managing director, has had many years experience in the passenger traffic, and the firm's reputation is well known in Northern Districts of the State.
Glenister and MacKenzie Fageol Ltd., is a registered company, with a capital of £75,000. The
directors are Senator Col P. P. Abbott (chairman) and Messrs., S. Glenister (managing director), Mr T. Knapton, R.A. Black, and A. Hutton and the secretary and assistant manager is Mr. Gordon Sargeant.
The Parramatta bus service will in future be conducted from a garage and office premises at Ester Street, Burwood and it is the new proprietors' intention, to see that the public convenience is studied in every possible way.

Cumberland Argus Friday 4th.June 1926

chevinoz · Post by **chevinoz** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:25 pm

Great stuff!

Centralian · Post by **Centralian** » Sun Jul 06, 2014 4:24 pm

Came across this post in trying to track down some info about Fageol operators in NSW. An image of a Fageol Parlor Coach was recently donated to the historical society I'm involved with of a Fageol posed in what appears to be one of the lookouts in Katoomba / Blue Mountains. It's rego is (NSW) 55.425 and the operator on the side is 'Gates Motor Tourist Service'. My guess would be late 20's to late '30's. I've drawn a blank in Trove and elsewhere trying to track down any info about 'Gates' and not someone I have listed as a Blue Mountains based operator of the time. Any clues out there ?

: Day's.jpg (89.2 KiB) Viewed 6315 times

Day's Motor Tourist Service was one operator in Sydney in the late '20's and '30's that operated Fageol's, and had the NSW Govt Tourist Bureau contract to run a service from Sydney to Jenolan Caves. The above shot shows a couple of Fageol's in their depot and is from the cover of one of their tour brochures of the time.

Centralian · Post by **Centralian** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:26 pm

An early advertisement for Fageol buses (about 1926) and a Fageol and passengers posed in NSW outside the Hartley Courthouse (this image is from Facebook).
A feature of Fageol buses were what I refer to as 'dinousaur scales' along the top of the bonnet.

: 1.jpg (50.81 KiB) Viewed 6154 times

: 2.jpg (29.39 KiB) Viewed 6154 times

Centralian · Post by **Centralian** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:03 pm

Here's a 1928 advertisement for Fageol. The bus depicted obviously would not run the service depicted and appears to have route 58 on its front.

: 1928.jpg (50.15 KiB) Viewed 6039 times

Bedford-29 · Post by **Bedford-29** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:49 pm

It would of been a rough ride from Glen Innes to Inverell as the roads weren`t chop in them days here is a couple of pictures of the Glenister and Mackenzie Fageol.Pictures from the Ken Magor collection.

GM · Post by GM » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:57 pm

From Robert Henderson's Sydney Bus Routes Web Site
Route 58 Clovelly – Bondi Junction – Central Railway
Flannery, AJF
City & Suburban Safety Coaches and/or
Gail, Mrs M
Seeing that the Fageols were called Safety Coaches I would assume the most likely operator was City and Suburban? GM

GM · Post by GM » Thu Jul 24, 2014 3:23 pm

Photos from my collection of Fageol Buses and Coaches from a number of operators. GM

Bedford-29 · Post by **Bedford-29** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:57 pm

Gee GM that Fageol DD would look more at home on the streets of Adelaide then the streets of Sydney and Parramatta.

Centralian · Post by **Centralian** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:40 pm

I wonder if that last shot coming off the harbour bridge was at its opening. Seems to be a formal occassion and the wagon wheel just visible in front may be from one of the horse buses that were in the parade.

GM · Post by GM » Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:59 pm

The open deck DD were operated by Sydney Safety Coaches who sold out the Parramatta - Sydney Service to Glenister and Mackenzie.
The top deck was removed because passengers would stand up when going under bridges with tragic results.
Refer extract from bus australia.
Refer photo number 9 of my post for the double deckers with tops removed, they are on the Right Hand side.
Yes Centralian that photo was from the opening of the Sydney Harbour Bridge. GM