Political discussion

[Enviro 500]

FPTP entrenches otherwise unelectable authoritarians in perpetuity while shutting out reformists. Precisely why no Nordic country ever uses it. Proportional representation effectively makes it impossible for anyone to claim majority. Not that they deserve it anyway.

Agree, yet look at the complaints from the usually far left or far right here when their team doesn't win and the first thing they blame is the electroal system rather than the leadership and candidates performance and quality of polices put on the table.

The Greens and One Nation do reasonably well to be allocated seats under the Nordic system. In fact, if opinion polls can be trusted, we may be getting Pauline Hanson for PM in 2028.

[rtt_rules]

Agree, yet look at the complaints from the usually far left or far right here when their team doesn't win and the first thing they blame is the electroal system rather than the leadership and candidates performance and quality of polices put on the table.

The Greens and One Nation do reasonably well to be allocated seats under the Nordic system. In fact, if opinion polls can be trusted, we may be getting Pauline Hanson for PM in 2028.

While PH is not always wrong, she is more wrong than right and not matured enough from being a mouthy minor party that has no chance of govt and knows it, just justifing why she should keep her and her parties job to actually being mature enough to run a country.

We don't need a Aussie version of the current USA which is basically tearing America apart from the inside. Leaders lead, unit, not dictate, not cause the community to divide and drive up agression on both sides towards the other as if they were about to slit your throat.

Currently ALP is holding their position and on TPP improving. I have never voted left in my life and not voted for last 12 years due to being off-shore and almost thankful I didn't have to vote last time as LNP was a complete cluster fk leading up to the election and since the whole right side has gone pear shaped and more of an embaressment to the country than asset. Honestly I feel like I'm watching Qld politics from the mid 2000's to early 2010's where ALP was repeatitly handed govt on a plate because LIB's and NAT couldn't even decide what time it was and argued publically over everything including who would actually be Premier.

Right now, ALBO just needs to keep his mouth quiet as much as possible and avoid any public screw ups by himself or his party and he will be PM for another few elections.

With nearly two years to go until ALBO has to call the next election its hard to see much changing. We won't have a Right wing govt, we may however have a minority ALP govt and potentially back to 2010 and the cluster Gillard/Rudd govt that followed, but at least last time the right side of politics were reasonably organised, this time...


Something else to consider, Pauline Hanson will be 73/74 yr come the next election, if voted in 77/78 for the following election. The next oldest PM was John McEwen who was 67 going on 68 when Holt died. William Mcmahon was the oldest at 63 to be elected. While age isn't everything, surely the evidence from the USA is that voting in mid to higher septuagenarians into office for the first time doesn't lead to a good outcome. Nothing wrong with them being in the house or on the payroll as advisors, but not country leaders FFS.

Barnby Joyce switched to ON as he's playing on bull shitttting easily lead mostly redneck voters and Pauline is in desperate need of a deputy and successor.

The USA midterms later this year will see someone likely settle down as his power will be heavily curtailed and then watch people jump ship and/or be fired like last time. With a pending electrol loss in 2028, the POTUS workforce will remember what happened to them last time, basically many found themselves unemployable. Many struggled to find equivalent work for years. Anyway, hopefully then the Americans can find someone half decent and we can get back to normal and stop tearing each other apart.

It also looks like ICE's reign of terror may also come to an end as shooting Americans expressing their rights to protest isn't going down well in mainstream, even right wing America. But you still have those idiots who believe in the 2nd ammendment every day of the week, unless you are protesting against ICE, not breaking the law and legally carrying a weapon in the holster, then its your fault.

[Heihachi_73]

We don't need a Aussie version of the current USA which is basically tearing America apart from the inside. Leaders lead, unit, not dictate, not cause the community to divide and drive up agression on both sides towards the other as if they were about to slit your throat.

The only thing we have going for us is that Australians generally don't fall for 1930s German-style populism unlike Americans; no-one worships politicians here, we see them in the same vein as a dodgy landlord or a used car salesman rather than someone to look up to.

That said, I think it's too late, Albo's second term has seen Labor shift slightly to the right of centre-right and is increasingly going down the Trumpist path with its slow-burn Project 2025-esque laws designed to curb political dissent (Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban are anything but a coincidence). Labor are no longer the progressive Hawke/Keating party of last century bringing Australia out of 1955, they are a capitalist neoconservative party which fail to even stand to the left of Turnbull's Liberals. When the Coalition or Murdoch or Rhinehart or America says jump, Labor say how high because they know if they don't toe the line they're out on their asre next election regardless of the voters. Meanwhile the Greens continually stumble all over the place injuring themselves trying to get in like Harry and Marv in Home Alone, with the emphasis on the latter. Labor can't move left, they can only maintain the status quo or head further right.

If Labor tanks during the next election because they have left everyone under the age of 60 for dead (as the Coalition did for under-70s) we'll be stuck with at least three years of One Nation, as the Liberals are all but dead if Sussssssssan, An_us and Ha_t_e are their only offers. Never thought the Greens would end up fourth behind three right-wing to far-right parties. Millennials are the Victoria of politics, they're broke and can't move forward even though they want to; they'll probably be the generation that skips Prime Ministership, with a Gen X PM in their late 70s (while coincidentally being born in the late 70s) being replaced by a born millionaire Gen Z Young Liberal god-bothering flat-earther following in the footsteps of Scummo. Hopefully it's not the case and we actually get a sane Gen Z leader instead.

[rtt_rules]

We don't need a Aussie version of the current USA which is basically tearing America apart from the inside. Leaders lead, unit, not dictate, not cause the community to divide and drive up agression on both sides towards the other as if they were about to slit your throat.

The only thing we have going for us is that Australians generally don't fall for 1930s German-style populism unlike Americans; no-one worships politicians here, we see them in the same vein as a dodgy landlord or a used car salesman rather than someone to look up to.

That said, I think it's too late, Albo's second term has seen Labor shift slightly to the right of centre-right and is increasingly going down the Trumpist path with its slow-burn Project 2025-esque laws designed to curb political dissent (Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban are anything but a coincidence). Labor are no longer the progressive Hawke/Keating party of last century bringing Australia out of 1955, they are a capitalist neoconservative party which fail to even stand to the left of Turnbull's Liberals. When the Coalition or Murdoch or Rhinehart or America says jump, Labor say how high because they know if they don't toe the line they're out on their asre next election regardless of the voters. Meanwhile the Greens continually stumble all over the place injuring themselves trying to get in like Harry and Marv in Home Alone, with the emphasis on the latter. Labor can't move left, they can only maintain the status quo or head further right.

If Labor tanks during the next election because they have left everyone under the age of 60 for dead (as the Coalition did for under-70s) we'll be stuck with at least three years of One Nation, as the Liberals are all but dead if Sussssssssan, An_us and Ha_t_e are their only offers. Never thought the Greens would end up fourth behind three right-wing to far-right parties. Millennials are the Victoria of politics, they're broke and can't move forward even though they want to; they'll probably be the generation that skips Prime Ministership, with a Gen X PM in their late 70s (while coincidentally being born in the late 70s) being replaced by a born millionaire Gen Z Young Liberal god-bothering flat-earther following in the footsteps of Scummo. Hopefully it's not the case and we actually get a sane Gen Z leader instead.

Right now One Nation / Pauline Hanson is on the rise via popularism promising everything and anything and openly lying about almost everything else.

Social media ban on under 16's is largely popular with parents with under 16's and unpopular with older people who's kids didn't grow up in the age of social media claiming "loss of freedoms" and indicating its poor parenting etc etc.

I think if PH is getting realistically close to forming govt in teh lead up to the next election, more centre left LIB's will vote ALP to keep her out. Again Australia doesn't need PM in their 70's dreaming of the good old days that were never actually that good and promising world peace to all while encouraging violence.

[Enviro 500]

We don't need a Aussie version of the current USA which is basically tearing America apart from the inside. Leaders lead, unit, not dictate, not cause the community to divide and drive up agression on both sides towards the other as if they were about to slit your throat.

The only thing we have going for us is that Australians generally don't fall for 1930s German-style populism unlike Americans; no-one worships politicians here, we see them in the same vein as a dodgy landlord or a used car salesman rather than someone to look up to.

That said, I think it's too late, Albo's second term has seen Labor shift slightly to the right of centre-right and is increasingly going down the Trumpist path with its slow-burn Project 2025-esque laws designed to curb political dissent (Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban are anything but a coincidence). Labor are no longer the progressive Hawke/Keating party of last century bringing Australia out of 1955, they are a capitalist neoconservative party which fail to even stand to the left of Turnbull's Liberals. When the Coalition or Murdoch or Rhinehart or America says jump, Labor say how high because they know if they don't toe the line they're out on their asre next election regardless of the voters. Meanwhile the Greens continually stumble all over the place injuring themselves trying to get in like Harry and Marv in Home Alone, with the emphasis on the latter. Labor can't move left, they can only maintain the status quo or head further right.

If Labor tanks during the next election because they have left everyone under the age of 60 for dead (as the Coalition did for under-70s) we'll be stuck with at least three years of One Nation, as the Liberals are all but dead if Sussssssssan, An_us and Ha_t_e are their only offers. Never thought the Greens would end up fourth behind three right-wing to far-right parties. Millennials are the Victoria of politics, they're broke and can't move forward even though they want to; they'll probably be the generation that skips Prime Ministership, with a Gen X PM in their late 70s (while coincidentally being born in the late 70s) being replaced by a born millionaire Gen Z Young Liberal god-bothering flat-earther following in the footsteps of Scummo. Hopefully it's not the case and we actually get a sane Gen Z leader instead.

Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban appear influenced by CCP more than anything.

Interestingly, the Greens raised concern over the social media ban. You just can't kick all kids off social media. Just stop signing up anyone under 16. Those under 16 already on it can keep their accounts under grandfathered clauses.

[rtt_rules]

Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban appear influenced by CCP more than anything.

Interestingly, the Greens raised concern over the social media ban. You just can't kick all kids off social media. Just stop signing up anyone under 16. Those under 16 already on it can keep their accounts under grandfathered clauses.

I would suggest the social media ban is actually influenced by the many millions of parents who are fighting this issue on a daily basis in their home. Along with the growing number of parents (roughly 100 per year) who lost children to suicide and other social issues because of social media. Then there is the teachers and growing anti-social behaviour issues at school all by kids filming events including bashings to get likes and views. Yesterday afternoon where I live two barely teen kids went missing for 3 h because they tried to do a social media challenge (sleep in a mall over night, not even 12 years old)

again, why is it that the majority of people who oppose it are older people, many of which do not even use social media and majority of people who support it have kids.

This is one of these issues where if it doesn't affect you directly, probably something you shouldn't be getting excited about and focus on other issues.

Our its managed is always up for debate and the Greens are not wrong or right.

Ideally I think kids can have social media, but like TV it needs censorship and governance, not a free for all posting what ever like what was happening.


On similar issue in NZ
The former Lab govt banned smoking for people born after 2009. The new National govt removed the ban claiming freedumbs and other BS etc etc.

Why was the ban lifted, because small shop owners were worried about loss of future income from smokes sales? So we are worried about small business (many of which would largely be unaffected) vs public health and NZ$ 1.3B pa savings in public health costs along with 5000 - 6000 premature deaths a year due to smoking?

Sometimes the obvious is in front of us, but still cannot see it.

[Enviro 500]

Albo's social media ban, Minns' protest ban and Allan's knife ban appear influenced by CCP more than anything.

Interestingly, the Greens raised concern over the social media ban. You just can't kick all kids off social media. Just stop signing up anyone under 16. Those under 16 already on it can keep their accounts under grandfathered clauses.

I would suggest the social media ban is actually influenced by the many millions of parents who are fighting this issue on a daily basis in their home. Along with the growing number of parents (roughly 100 per year) who lost children to suicide and other social issues because of social media. Then there is the teachers and growing anti-social behaviour issues at school all by kids filming events including bashings to get likes and views. Yesterday afternoon where I live two barely teen kids went missing for 3 h because they tried to do a social media challenge (sleep in a mall over night, not even 12 years old)

again, why is it that the majority of people who oppose it are older people, many of which do not even use social media and majority of people who support it have kids.

This is one of these issues where if it doesn't affect you directly, probably something you shouldn't be getting excited about and focus on other issues.

Our its managed is always up for debate and the Greens are not wrong or right.

Ideally I think kids can have social media, but like TV it needs censorship and governance, not a free for all posting what ever like what was happening.


On similar issue in NZ
The former Lab govt banned smoking for people born after 2009. The new National govt removed the ban claiming freedumbs and other BS etc etc.

Why was the ban lifted, because small shop owners were worried about loss of future income from smokes sales? So we are worried about small business (many of which would largely be unaffected) vs public health and NZ$ 1.3B pa savings in public health costs along with 5000 - 6000 premature deaths a year due to smoking?

Sometimes the obvious is in front of us, but still cannot see it.

Shoulda put it to a referendum. That way they'll know if the original legislation works or if it's well-received.

[Heihachi_73]

Ah, Chris Minns reading through Andrews' discarded COVID playbook during Herzog's visit. I had wondered where that book vanished; in a few more pages you should find out what "circuit breaker" means. Suck it up NSW for electing Scummo and Bin Chicken!

[Enviro 500]

Well, I'd like to see Isaac Herzog and Jacinta Price doing the 69. They both are awful individuals who deserve one another.

[rtt_rules]

Shoulda put it to a referendum. That way they'll know if the original legislation works or if it's well-received.

Referendum's are for changing the consitution, this is not a consitution change so not appropriate tool that woudl cost over $200M

Also a referendum doesn't seperate parents facing the issue those who don't so also irrelevent. Like asking men our women should manage their bodies.

What tools we do have to know if its the right thing is numerous surveys
https://www.monash.edu/news/articles/4- ... n-for-kids
https://au.yougov.com/politics/articles ... ustralians
etc
Pointing to a similar story of +75% support

Not sure if there are surveys that should less than 50% but the few I found all point in the same direction.

Also other countries looking at doing something similar so I think the evidence is there its the correct thing to do, even if those without kids below age 16 don't agree and its not their problem so no need to be concerned.

[Enviro 500]

Shoulda put it to a referendum. That way they'll know if the original legislation works or if it's well-received.

Referendum's are for changing the consitution, this is not a consitution change so not appropriate tool that woudl cost over $200M

Also a referendum doesn't seperate parents facing the issue those who don't so also irrelevent. Like asking men our women should manage their bodies.

What tools we do have to know if its the right thing is numerous surveys
https://www.monash.edu/news/articles/4- ... n-for-kids
https://au.yougov.com/politics/articles ... ustralians
etc
Pointing to a similar story of +75% support

Not sure if there are surveys that should less than 50% but the few I found all point in the same direction.

Also other countries looking at doing something similar so I think the evidence is there its the correct thing to do, even if those without kids below age 16 don't agree and its not their problem so no need to be concerned.

Well, Switzerland lets public opinion shape its legislation directly. Wonder how they manage to spend so much on referendums without breaking the bank.

[rtt_rules]

Well, Switzerland lets public opinion shape its legislation directly. Wonder how they manage to spend so much on referendums without breaking the bank.

They use lower cost methods such as non-compulsory voting, mail and more recently e-voting. Also they are grouped with other events.

Regardless it still costs money and money that could be spent on other things and while it would usable to have something with direct govt feedback with some control, this isn't one of them as the surveys show a strong preference.

I'm not against with surveying to be done in conjunction with any fed election.

[Heihachi_73]

Good riddance to Viktor Orbán. Now, can the world do the same with Putin, Trump, Lukashenko, Fico etc. already?

[Heihachi_73]

"If a visa holder undermines our democratic values, doesn't respect the law, or demonstrates they don't respect our core values, they will be booted out of Australia," Mr Taylor will say.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-04-13/ ... /106559472

(Gestures towards the Liberal Party of Australia, One Nation and the 30 or so other Christofascist political parties hiding behind parliamentary immunity) Off to the UK with you, then.

When was the last time a right-wing politician respected the law and Australian core values? I'm really struggling to not include the current Australian Labor Party in that list (Albo can do way better but he'd be 1975'd and replaced with An_us the instant he did anything even remotely centrist as opposed to tiptoeing around on the conservative side and keeping the place clean for the next Liberal PM).

[rtt_rules]

"If a visa holder undermines our democratic values, doesn't respect the law, or demonstrates they don't respect our core values, they will be booted out of Australia," Mr Taylor will say.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-04-13/ ... /106559472

(Gestures towards the Liberal Party of Australia, One Nation and the 30 or so other Christofascist political parties hiding behind parliamentary immunity) Off to the UK with you, then.

When was the last time a right-wing politician respected the law and Australian core values? I'm really struggling to not include the current Australian Labor Party in that list (Albo can do way better but he'd be 1975'd and replaced with An_us the instant he did anything even remotely centrist as opposed to tiptoeing around on the conservative side and keeping the place clean for the next Liberal PM).

First bit.

Yes, I agree there should be a minimum two year trial for those applying for Citizenship via PR because while they still have a PR (Permanent Residency) they still have foreign nationality and can legally be deported. Once they get citizenship and if they then proceed to cancel their foreign citizenship (most likely don't), they can no longer be deported.

Likewise on Visa's, yes you don't deal with problems internally, you deport them.

Having said all this, the number of immigrants who cause issues are actually quite low and much lower than the domestic population. However what are often the problem is the off-spring, typically not knowing their place in the world and for what ever reason becoming angry with Australia and typically "white Australians" (what I noticed in the 80's as a kid).

Typically I would be right leaning, however the last 3 -4 years I found the right side of politics and especially ON and NAT's has followed the Trump style politics of just lying left, right and centre and taregtting the poorly educated and easily tricked. Working in aluminium and just personal interest, I have a very close / unhealthy focus on electricty generation and the future and ON and NAT's are just lying through their teeth on this topic. Their plans are impractical to impossible to implement and costs will rise. The LIB's Nuclear policy for the last election was a cluster Fk of a plan with more holes than swiss cheese. You know its wrong with the Conservative side of politics promotes socialistic policies.

2nd bit
As for ALBO and Bowen. ALBO was seen as the saviour for the ALP for some years held back by the inability to dump Billy and too be honest as PM I don't think he's do a bad job, not perfect and room to improve and non of them are but overall, mmm. Bowen with regard to energy similar.

What I don't like (back to electricty) was that SCOMO's plan to RE, was reasonable and largely what is happening today is still part of the LNP policy and actions. But ALBO wanted to be different and do more trying to encourage (he cannot force despite what people think) coal to close sooner. Unfortunately this is what drove Dutton to go down the stupid half baked Nuclear path.

It was also interesting that the ALP had long supported EV's, the one form of personal transport that disconnects the user from oil prices and potential shortages. LNP / ON have been largely attacking EV's at every corner. Skynews commentors can barely even pronouce the words "electrical vehicles". Yet when oil prices and supply were becoming an issue, what has LNP / ON done, gone harder against EV's rather than even consider it as a partial option.

Working OS, I was not required to vote in 2022 and 2025 and TBH, I was happy not to last year as I didn't want to tick that other box and both my dad and FIL who are both hard right leaning were struggling. My FIL did a donkey vote (my electroate is the same as his and one of the safest National Party seats, also highest in the country with PV rooftop solar)

So yes right now, I agree with you on the lack of core values. Not sure if its got worse because of Trump with them copying is style (Something Dutton started and then back down as Trump started to Fk things up after he took office), but certainly feels this way.

ALBO just need to play a safe game, not let the unions dictate policy and start with the more hard left BS that has plauged some ALP govts of the past also avoiding any major screw ups and he will be in power for at least one more term after this one as the right side of politics is far from ready to goven the country as they are still fighting amongst themselves with the Nationals despirately trying to justify their future and position within the LNP in light of the boom of ON in rural areas.

Howard lasted I think 11 years, which many have said failure by the LNP to transition to a new PM in his 4th term contributed to the party's election loss in 2007 as he had gathered too much baggage and young voters have too short an attention span and looking for change. So assuming ALBO wins the next election in 2028, this should be his last and hand over (not be removed as the LIBs have prived this doesn't work either) to who ever by around 2030 and give them a year to build their brand for the 2031 election.

[Enviro 500]

One Nation just won the by-election in Farrer, which former Liberal leader Susan Ley once held. If I were David Farley I'd be paying tribute to the ISIS brides. One Nation's success is all down to them.

[Heihachi_73]

No discernible difference. The Coalition are actually slightly further to the right of One Nation (albeit slightly less authoritarian because Small Government) according to Political Compass.

https://www.politicalcompass.org/aus2025
https://www.politicalcompass.org/aus2022

The Liberals existed solely to be the anti-Labor Party party because the 1950s Red Scare. Their time was up when Labor became the Liberals as the major conservative party instead of remaining as the centre-left Fix It Felix party which existed solely to undo the wrongdoings and status quo austerity measures under the Liberals which end up leaving Australia endlessly trying to catch up to the rest of the developed world. We need a centrist party to counter the right-wing and the far-right duopoly; The Greens aren't it, as proven by their pathetic vote count every single election where these days they can't even fend off Pauline Hanson of all people.

[rtt_rules]

One Nation just won the by-election in Farrer, which former Liberal leader Susan Ley once held. If I were David Farley I'd be paying tribute to the ISIS brides. One Nation's success is all down to them.

ISIS brides were always coming back home, they are Australian citizens with no other nationality which forces the govt to allow them to return under the Geneva convention and Syria basically deporting them. ON, LIBs and NAT's would have all had to do the same.

[rtt_rules]

Farrer is physically close to the seats in SA won by ON. It was certainly a very strong win but this is the views of the rural areas which turning their back on The Nationals.

The upcoming Vic state election will identify how strong ON really is because if they only get a few seats like SA, then they have no hope at govt at fed level. Personally I do not see significant support for ON in the suburbs and without the suburbs they are basically The Nationals Mk2 etc.