NSW Bus Observations 2022.

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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Merc1107 »

It isn't just Sydney with a crippling shortage of drivers (i.e. this isn't something that can be pinned on privatisation).

Nationwide, staffing is somewhere between a serious and critical issue for operators. I'm hearing of problems in several states, both in the sphere of public (Government & private run) and charter work, even the cities paying exceedingly generous wages for job (Perth & Canberra). Hearing of Charter work going in Darwin with "as much work as you can do" for $44/hr.

Have also encountered a few ex STA types of late ... from what I am hearing about the pay system there, it was such a complicated mess (undoubtedly worsened by the deliberately vague wording that plagues enterprise agreements) that not even payroll could explain it!
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Stu »

J_Busworth wrote: Thu Aug 11, 2022 5:46 pm Route X81 is being advertised on the event page and on the map as 'Bondi Shuttle' in lieu of X81. Unsure as to why this decision has been made.

AFAIK, all of the ex STA regions have been requested to provide buses by Transport. TSA, KD, TJHB and Busways will all be operating services for City to Surf this year.
Definitely no official X81 service will be in operation despite Birriga Rd and Curlewis St being open with other bus services operating on those roads. The shuttle service will apparently be displaying X81 although does not follow route X81 and instead operates via Bondi Rd. There is a contingency plan to divert via Ocean St, Birrell St and Bronte Rd if the expected heavy traffic on Bondi Rd is causing lengthy delays.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Swift »

Merc1107 wrote: Sat Aug 13, 2022 8:04 pm .
Nationwide, staffing is somewhere between a serious and critical issue for operators. I'm hearing of problems in several states, both in the sphere of public (Government & private run) and charter work, even the cities paying exceedingly generous wages for job (Perth & Canberra). Hearing of Charter work going in Darwin with "as much work as you can do" for $44/hr.
It shows that it's shabby treatment of drivers, the depot petty politics as well as unsociable hours that makes the job unsatisfying and unattractive. Yet there's a persistent refusal to address those so they will continue to have a high turnover rate of staff. There's a price to pay for being stubborn and holding on to ways that don't work.
It doesn't help we have buses that make my front loader washing machine seem spellbindingly fascinating by comparison these days, with lots of glitches and with design input by anyone but a person that will drive them.
Leyland managed to do it with the National more than fifty years ago.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Merc1107 »

Swift wrote: Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:42 pm It shows that it's shabby treatment of drivers, the depot petty politics as well as unsociable hours that makes the job unsatisfying and unattractive. Yet there's a persistent refusal to address those so they will continue to have a high turnover rate of staff.
There's no denying there are players in the industry who do not treat their staff particularly well. It's a stretch to consider that is an issue with every operator, though.

On the point in bold. Every depot seems to have its collection of drivers who are perpetually incensed/outraged/offended at some development (real or imagined) going on. Their vocal complaining drags down the morale of other staff, who otherwise go about their work cheerfully or at least indifferent to whatever is going on. I have witnessed instances where these types have resulted in more interesting bus types being "banned" from types of work because of some conceived "safety issue" (in reality, they always worked splits and wanted to drive a new bus with 500km on the dial). In another case these miserable pricks have vilified a friend of mine, who was elected to a committee and set about trying to make rostering practices more fair and equitable ... the vilification and lack of gratitude of the staff became such an issue they walked away from the committee and ultimately transferred depots. Yet these crankies cannot be sacked (not even for the attrition their antics cause), because that would not only make staffing issues worse, it would spur new rumours of "persecution" among the remaining toxic elements.

I cannot see how the work can be made less unsociable. Running buses from 9-5 isn't much help to the general population, nor does it do much for availability of work. The maligned split shift won't go anywhere until more is done to give people all-day, frequent bus services that reduce the difference between peak and off-peak bus requirements.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Jurassic_Joke »

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/PrpELJxTL74

A somewhat entertaining exchange whereby a bus driver (unknown operator) refuses to open the rear door for an alighting passenger and makes them exit through the front
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Merc1107 »

The video lacks context for us to see why the door wasn't opened. At least in my experience though, it is rare to encounter a situation where the stop placement is so poor that the back doors cannot be used.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

Just a leftover of "legacy" private operators' policies, still practiced from my observations.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by tonyp »

Merc1107 wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:33 am The video lacks context for us to see why the door wasn't opened. At least in my experience though, it is rare to encounter a situation where the stop placement is so poor that the back doors cannot be used.
TfNSW policy is to leave it to the discretion of the individual drivers whether they open any centre and rear doors or not, which inconsistency is pretty confusing for passengers.

For one thing, it's a Bustech, so the driver might have experienced an incident with a passenger falling down the centre door stairs. I rode a Bustech bus in Wollongong once where the driver said just that by way of apologising for not opening the door. Count your lucky stars that you don't have Bustechs in WA because PTA's higher design and operating standards would preclude them.

Another thing is that there might have been a tree or another obstacle in the way of the door, though the street looks pretty bare in the video. Again, unlike WA, TfNSW takes little initiative in enforcing design standards for bus stops, leaving it to local councils which almost universally couldn't care less. There's a very busy bus stop in Clara St, Randwick where there's a tree, electrical substation and garbage bin repository lined up against the centre and rear doors of any bus that stops there. At another stop in Wollongong, the council has put a metal rail fence along the kerb, with a gap for the front door but no other gap for other doors.

I wouldn't say it's a private operator thing, apart from CDC which appears to have - or had when I used them - a general set against opening any rear doors. It was certainly not a thing among private operators of old who would open all doors if there was a bus or footpath conductor around and, in any case, would open the rear door for exit. The rot set in with driver-only operation in jurisdictions where a pre-pay system had not been set up to replace conductors, which is what happened in continental Europe where all-door boarding remained. In Australia, Britain and North America, the very efficient back door was moved down to the centre of the bus in order to give the driver better vision in the days of mirrors, resulting in the clogged cave at the back of the bus which is a universal feature here nowadays.

A combination of non-thinking transit agencies and operators and union politics has brought us to the inconsistent mess we have today. Now it's all a game we're required to play - which door is going to open and does it require pressing a button or will it open anyway? To which some jurisdictions add: you can board at any door in that bus, but not in this one. Adelaide at one stage "refined" that by allowing one thing at certain times of day and not at other times. That didn't last long. Inconsistency is a no no in any efficient transit operation.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

I have complained to councils about "obstructions" in the path of rear door access/egress, usually seats, garbage bins, trees, etc.

The response has been that they comply with "TfNSW standards for placement of street furniture at bus stops".
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by tonyp »

boronia wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:22 pm I have complained to councils about "obstructions" in the path of rear door access/egress, usually seats, garbage bins, trees, etc.

The response has been that they comply with "TfNSW standards for placement of street furniture at bus stops".
Oh well, now we know what the TfNSW standards are - all street furniture must only be located at bus stops. Still, beats alighting into a drainage ditch in the country.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Merc1107 »

My own lived experience has been that a hazard report can rattle the chains hard enough the Councils/Government haven't any choice but to react ... that wasn't NSW though.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

Everything would be so much easier for drivers if passengers were educated to know the differences between sounds it comes to opal readers that’s if the passenger has good hearing and doesn’t have headphones in
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

Seems T-JH has been "tweaking" the destination files on eastern suburbs buses over the last week or so. I've noticed a few subtle changes:

399 outbound now shows MALABAR HTS + LITTLE BAY instead of LITTLE BAY (via Malabar Hts); inbound shows just UNSW instead of UNSW - DAY AVE.

304 displaying ZETLAND VIA ROSEBERY, instead of just large ZETLAND

339 now includes "VIA CLOVELLY RD" in the bottom line scrolling. Some other routes may also have extra "via..." lines, but I haven't had a chance to check them all out yet.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Swift »

Tweaking or meddling for it's own sake??
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by swtt »

boronia wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:32 pm Seems T-JH has been "tweaking" the destination files on eastern suburbs buses over the last week or so. I've noticed a few subtle changes:

399 outbound now shows MALABAR HTS + LITTLE BAY instead of LITTLE BAY (via Malabar Hts); inbound shows just UNSW instead of UNSW - DAY AVE.

304 displaying ZETLAND VIA ROSEBERY, instead of just large ZETLAND

339 now includes "VIA CLOVELLY RD" in the bottom line scrolling. Some other routes may also have extra "via..." lines, but I haven't had a chance to check them all out yet.

They're not bad moves.

399 outbound predominantly serves Malabar Heights instead of Little Bay, in the same way that 243 serves Nth Cremorne predominantly but terminates at Brady St Spit Jn.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

Swift wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:01 pm Tweaking or meddling for it's own sake??
If it introduces some commonality in the information displayed, it is a good thing.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by tonyp »

This is only a couple of weeks away but no sign of any timetables or other information yet:

https://www.busnews.com.au/industry-new ... -for-nowra?
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Fleet Lists »

It is also up on Transport Info https://transportnsw.info/news/2022/bet ... ater-nowra

with a map at https://transportnsw.info/document/6062 ... _a4_v1.pdf

Monday 15 August 2022

Greater Nowra will receive more than 250 new additional weekly bus services as part of bus network improvements in the region from Monday 29 August 2022.

There will be more peak and weekend services, more direct routes, and longer operating hours to connect customers to where they need to go.

The new bus network includes better connections with Nowra CBD, Bomaderry train station and Vincentia HomeCo and Shopping Village.

Suburbs including Twin Waters Estate, Worrigee and Erowal Bay will also receive improved services.


Bus route changes
Route Changes

101
East Nowra and Worrigee to Nowra
and Bomaderry


Route 101 will provide an improved service to East Nowra and Worrigee. West Nowra will be serviced by the new Route 106 and Route 106X.
Route changes to improve coverage and reduce travel times through Worrigee.
More frequent services.
New Sunday and public holiday services.
Better connections to train services at Bomaderry Station during weekday peak hours.
8 additional weekly services.

102
Basin View to Bomaderry via St Georges Basin, Sanctuary Point, Vincentia, South Nowra and Nowra


Simpler route will no longer operate as a loop service and will now operate in both directions throughout the day.
Route will no longer operate through Tomerong.
More frequent services.
New public holiday services.
Better connections to train services at Bomaderry Station.
44 additional weekly services.

102X
St Georges Basin to Bomaderry via Sanctuary Point, Vincentia, South Nowra and Nowra


New service providing faster, more direct journeys to/from the Bay & Basin area to Nowra CBD and Bomaderry Station.
Better connections to train services at Bomaderry Station.
82 new weekly services.

103
Hyams Beach to Bomaderry via Erowal Bay


The 103 is being replaced by the 104. The 104 provides more frequent services for customers in Erowal Bay and Hyams Beach to Vincentia. Customers in these areas who need to travel to Nowra can interchange for a service at Vincentia.

104
Hyams Beach to Vincentia via Erowal Bay
(Replaces Route 103 – Hyams Beach to
Bomaderry via Erowal Bay)


New route between Hyams Beach, Erowal Bay and Vincentia.
More frequent services.
New Saturday services.
Connections available at Vincentia HomeCo to Route 102 and 102X for travel to/from Nowra and Bomaderry.
39 new weekly services

106
West Nowra to Nowra


New route between West Nowra and Nowra.
Replaces previous Route 101 services that operated via West Nowra.
33 new weekly services.

106X
West Nowra UOW Shoalhaven Campus
to Bomaderry


New route providing a fast and direct weekday return link between UOW Shoalhaven Campus, Nowra CBD and Bomaderry Station.
Better connections to train services at Bomaderry Station.
10 new weekly services.

111
Orient Point to Nowra via Culburra Beach, Greenwell Point and Bomaderry Station


New morning service connects with train departing Bomaderry Station at 06:43.
New morning service via Greenwell Point.
New evening service connects with train arriving Bomaderry Station at 19:19.
10 additional weekly services.

120
Callala and Currarong to Nowra via Myola


New morning service connects with train departing Bomaderry Station at 06:43.
New evening service connects with train arriving at Bomaderry Station at 17:10.
10 additional weekly services.

131
Nowra to Bomaderry (Loop Service)


New morning service connects with Route 737 bus to Kiama, departing Bomaderry Station at 07:00.
Earlier morning travel options to Nowra CBD.
5 additional weekly services.

132
North Nowra to Nowra (Loop service)


New morning service connects with train departing Bomaderry Station at 06:43.
Earlier morning travel options to Nowra CBD.
5 additional weekly services.

134
Berrara and Sussex Inlet to Vincentia via Tomerong and Vincentia HomeCo


New route operates between Berrara, Sussex Inlet and Vincentia, along Pine Forest Road, Tomerong.
Better links from Berrara and Sussex Inlet to essential shopping and services.
Services operate Monday to Saturday.
24 new weekly services.

135
Berrara to Bomaderry Station via Sussex Inlet, Tomerong & Nowra


New morning service connects with train departing Bomaderry Station at 06:43.
New evening service connects with train arriving at Bomaderry Station at 17:10.
Earlier morning and later evening travel options to South Nowra, Nowra CBD and Bomaderry.
15 additional weekly services.

139
Nowra to Shoalhaven Heads via Bomaderry Station


New evening service connects with train arriving at Bomaderry Station at 17:10.
Later evening travel options to Nowra CBD and train services at Bomaderry Station.
5 additional weekly services.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by tonyp »

Thanks. There are some gaps in the information and the map. Seems like a rushed job, considering they've been working on it a long time and only two weeks to go. No sign of timetables yet. But I get the general picture. There are 100,000 people living in Shoalhaven. This is many years overdue. In the absence of Opal, I wonder what the fare situation will be for the newly-enforced interchange between some routes?

Funnily enough, for all the upgrade in services, the direct route that I have mostly used over the years will no longer exist and it's back to the car! I guess I'll wear that sacrifice knowing that everybody else (mostly) will get better service.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by ScaniaGrenda »

tonyp wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 12:26 am Funnily enough, for all the upgrade in services, the direct route that I have mostly used over the years will no longer exist and it's back to the car! I guess I'll wear that sacrifice knowing that everybody else (mostly) will get better service.
Sounds like typical TransportNSW at work, take what works well with a single bus route away, now making people hop through 2-3 different bus routes (that the transfer time could blow out & leave one waiting a while for the next bus or god forbid one of your buses isn't scheduled to run on that day at all) just to get to the same destination taking more time compared to when all that was previously needed was a single direct bus route.

If their outcome was to push people back to cars (which wouldn't surprise me) then congratulations, they achieved just that.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

boronia wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:32 pm Seems T-JH has been "tweaking" the destination files on eastern suburbs buses over the last week or so. I've noticed a few subtle changes:

399 outbound now shows MALABAR HTS + LITTLE BAY instead of LITTLE BAY (via Malabar Hts); inbound shows just UNSW instead of UNSW - DAY AVE.

304 displaying ZETLAND VIA ROSEBERY, instead of just large ZETLAND

339 now includes "VIA CLOVELLY RD" in the bottom line scrolling. Some other routes may also have extra "via..." lines, but I haven't had a chance to check them all out yet.
Some more:
The 350 now goes to DOMESTIC AIRPORT (prev just DOMESTIC).
396 now operates VIA TAYLOR SQ.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Transport Buff »

Anyone noticed the TJHB logo on the desto of some R9 TJHB buses - used as a default instead of 'Not in Service' or when specialing back to depot? Haven't seen/noticed it until about a week ago. Seems like a new update to the desto files?
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Glen »

In my experience CDC Region 4 drivers consistently use back doors now, especially since Covid.

Once upon a time that was certainly not the case.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by Swift »

Glen wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 5:16 pm In my experience CDC Region 4 drivers consistently use back doors now, especially since Covid.

Once upon a time that was certainly not the case.
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Re: NSW Bus Observations 2022.

Post by boronia »

News report of a nasty accident between a T-way bus and a semi-trailer at Wetherill Park last night. A 74 year old bus driver suffered severe lower body injuries; the truck driver has been charged.
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