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New international airport?

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New international airport?

Postby Roderick Smith » Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:01 pm

This is an upgrade of an existing one, but reinforces my joke that, when Keilor residents become Essendon clones, the call will be to relocate Melbourne Airport to Korong Vale.
170225Sa Melbourne 'Herald Sun' - new airport?

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Re: New international airport?

Postby Roderick Smith » Wed Mar 15, 2017 1:27 pm

New Melbourne airport: Land to be secured in next five years, Andrews Government pledges.
Transport reporter, Herald Sun March 14, 2017.
LAND near Koo Wee Rup, in Melbourne’s south east, could be the site of Melbourne’s new airport.
The Andrews Government has pledged to secure the land for the new airport, likely to cost $5 billion, in the next five years.
It would supplement the existing main international airport at Tullamarine and the secondary low-cost option at Avalon, near Geelong.
A southeast airport would serve one third of the state’s population and be near tourist attractions such as Phillip Island and the Mornington Peninsula.
A third airport is a key feature of Plan Melbourne 2017-2050 — the Government’s metropolitan strategy for the next 33 years.
A third airport is a key feature of Plan Melbourne 2017-2050. Picture: iStock The State Government has vowed to preserve this future option by incorporating planning protection for flight paths and noise contours and the alignment for a connection to the rail line at Clyde.
Planning Minister Richard Wynne said the airport had been earmarked for operation beyond 2030, should demand warrant it.
“Melbourne Airport and Avalon Airport still have capacity to take more flights, but nevertheless we won’t make the same mistakes Sydney has made,” Mr Wynne said.
“We need to plan ahead for aviation to avoid being blind sided as Victoria grows.”
The State Government said it would be up to the Commonwealth Government to grant aviation approvals and the private sector to fund any development.
Rosemary West, from the Green Wedges Coalition, said the group was against the plan.
“We don’t want another airport covered in shopping centres and other commercial developments not normally allowed in the Green Wedges,” she said.
The Shire of Cardinia mayor Brett Owen said the council welcomed the State Government’s commitment to identify and select a suitable location for an airport in the south east region.
“Our region will continue to experience significant growth over the coming years and SEM believes the development and operation of an airport will be a major economic and employment driver for our communities,” Cr Owen said.
“We also welcome the commitment by the State Government to incorporate a connection to the rail line at Clyde as part of their investigation into possible sites.”
Melbourne Airport spokeswoman Carly Dixon said Victoria’s southeast was an ideal location to begin the planning process for a new airport.
“With long-term considerations such as land ownership, noise contours, flight paths and market access all to consider, we’re very supportive of moves to start that safeguarding process within the scope of this latest update to Plan Melbourne,” she said.
A Qantas plane with a new logo makes its debut landing in Melbourne last year.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victor ... ef7e602b7c
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Re: New international airport?

Postby boronia » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:37 pm

There is a new airport in Toowoomba, operating on a similar basis. Privately owned, mainly for freight.
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Re: New international airport?

Postby V981 » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:47 pm

Personally I put this proposed second airport in the same category as the proposed rail link to Tullamarine Airport. We will still be discussing the proposals in 40 years time. :lol:
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Re: New international airport?

Postby 1whoknows » Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:17 am

Call Eddy. We clearly need Parrahub from Tulla - City - KWR to make it all work.
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Re: New international airport?

Postby Roderick Smith » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:58 pm

This one has been on the cards since WWII, when construction of a military airport south of Pakenham was aborted. The first concept was for Clyde, but suburban encroachment has shifted the site further out.


July 4 2017 Proposed Koo Wee Rup airport would be 'Melbourne's Badgerys Creek' .
Ambitious plans to build a major airport near Koo Wee Rup have been described as Melbourne's answer to Sydney's Badgerys Creek project.
Paragon Premier Investment Fund has said it wants to build the commercial airport at a site between Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang. It said the airport could be operating cargo flights by 2020, followed by domestic and international services.
More videos Koo Wee Rup international airport.
While the location hasn't been decided yet, Melbourne's newest airport would be built on farmland near Koo Wee Rup. Vision courtesy Seven News, Melbourne.
Aviation consultant Neil Hansford, who has advised on airport development, said Melbourne needed a major domestic airport to supplement Tullamarine, and Avalon Airport, near Geelong, could not fulfil that role because of its location.
"Sydney has Kingsford Smith and it needs Badgerys Creek, so Melbourne is in exactly the same situation," he said.
The federal government last month said it would build Sydney's second major airport at Badgerys Creek to service the city's booming western suburbs, ending decades of dispute over the project.
Avalon is an international airport, but it has not been able to attract overseas flights and serves only low-cost carrier Jetstar on routes to Sydney, Hobart, Adelaide and the Gold Coast.
Melbourne Airport's chief executive said last week that Avalon was too close to Tullamarine to be Melbourne's No.2 airport.
With Melbourne's population set to surge past 7 million over the next three decades, Mr Hansford said the city should look to London, which has has four airports to service its 8.7 million citizens, as a model of how to plan for a city that size.
Melbourne's south-east has been described as a better location than Avalon for Melbourne's No.2 airport. Photo: Craig Abraham .
However, he said there would not be demand for international flights or cargo from a south-eastern airport for another 10 to 15 years.
Paragon has said it wants to focus on cargo when the airport opens – particularly to ship fresh agricultural produce from Gippsland to overseas markets – and start passenger flights soon after.
The airport would initially be the size of Canberra Airport. Photo: Canberra Airport .
The privately funded Wellcamp Airport in Toowoomba, Queensland, opened in 2014 with the intention of being a base for fresh food exports, while Qantas Freight is trying to establish shipments of fresh milk from Tasmania to China.
Noel Campbell, a dairy farmer whose Yannathan property is about eight kilometres east of the proposed airport site, said nobody would want an airport built on their doorstep.
"But from a wider community perspective, there's possibly a need for something on the south-east of Melbourne," he said.
Mr Campbell said he doubted the demand for agricultural exports from the airport would have a significant impact on dairy or horticulture farmers in the area.
Mr Hansford said a fresh produce business would only be viable if the planes brought manufactured goods to Australia on their inbound flights.
He said transporting those goods would be difficult from Koo Wee Rup, because Melbourne's distribution industry was based in the city's west.
The proposed airport is on farmland the state government would need to rezone as commercial and industrial, and could compulsorily acquire it if it decided to back the project.
Cardinia Shire councillor Ray Brown, whose Port Ward covers the area of the proposed site, said there were mixed feelings among locals.
"Most of it is of the opinion that it will never happen, of course," he said. "Nobody I've spoken to is against it at all. Most people are saying it's exciting news, but that's all it really is at the moment."
If the airport is built on the proposed site in Caldermeade, the flight path could be over Western Port, which would minimise disruption to residents, Cr Brown said.
In 2013, the then Coalition state government's Plan Melbourne strategy recommended identifying land for for an airport between Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang.
On Tuesday Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews said the government was "focused on upgrading connections to Melbourne Airport".
"We're also focused ... on Avalon," he said.
Related Articles:
Backing secured for major airport serving Melbourne's south-east .
AAP http://www.theage.com.au/business/aviat ... x4au5.html

July 7 2017 Cow dung and daisies: Melbourne's south-east dreams of a new airport (again).
The engine on the four-wheel-drive is flooded, so Robert Bourke, 77 but sprightly, takes the quad bike instead. He leads us up a blacktop road that turns into gravel and then out into the middle of a muddy paddock. His cattle look on curiously.
The land here, on Melbourne's south-eastern fringes, is flat, and you can see the horizon all way round. The sky is a great blue bowl overhead, with a few streaky clouds sliding toward the edges. A stiff northerly is blowing. Ceiling and visibility unlimited, pilots would say.
Cattle farmer Robert Bourke's family has owned land in Monomeith, Gippsland, since 1903. Photo: Joe Armao
Mr Bourke's paddock, parts of which are presently under water, is supposed to be where Melbourne's new multibillion-dollar international airport will be built.
Maybe. Locals have been hearing about this airport for decades, and are sceptical. "We'll believe it when we see it," says one.
Airport or no, this place is about to change. Property developers have already sold hundreds of houses off the plan in the two major local towns of Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang, their future residents are just waiting for plasterboarding to finish. Melbourne is sprawling at the edges, the city hungrily gobbling up small towns and farms. These one-street towns are waiting for the other boot to drop.
The plan: a $7 billion privately owned international airport, organised by a private investment fund and bankrolled by an as-yet-unnamed Middle Eastern and European consortium.
"We're literally going to build and say 'here it is'," Paragon Premier Investment Fund chairman Alande Mustafa Safi said this week. "The funds are ready, the developers are ready."
The two-runway airport is supposed to be the size of Canberra's, with cargo flights starting in 2020 and passenger services soon after.
The government has long planned for a south-eastern airport. As far back as 1995 reports were claiming one would be viable, and an airport between Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang was pinpointed by the government's Plan Melbourne strategy in 2013. About 85 kilometres south-east of Melbourne, it would cater to one-third of Victoria's population, and be near the Port of Hastings.
"From Gippsland to Tullamarine it's 3.5 hours, but to the Koo Wee Rup proposed airport it will be a 45-minute drive and then overnight to the Asian market, where the demand is," Mr Safi said.
But before these paddocks were to be the site of a new international airport, there was an old wartime airstrip here.
The cross-shaped runway runs right across Mr Bourke's property.
There's not much of it left, just some old concrete drains and big chunks of gravel in amid the grass tussocks and cow dung. You can see it better from the air, or in spring when daisies bloom across its length.
"You can see the mess," says Mr Bourke, squelching through the muddy paddock in gumboots, dodging a fresh cow pat. "If you can get a jumbo jet into here you'd have to be a very good pilot."
The government bought the land off Mr Bourke's ancestor for about $25,000 during World War II, laid a gravel runway, and made plans to base a squadron of dive-bombers there. Local farmers were told to move their cattle away because the whole area was now a target for Japanese bombing raids. There were even plans for a full military aerodrome, although the war ended before work got seriously under way.
The last plane to touch down here was a DC-9 that blew an oil tube mid-flight in 1947. By then the military had given the land back to Mr Bourke's grandfather. The pilot made an emergency landing. Mr Bourke remembers, as a child, watching passengers bale out into a field of curious cows.
The Bourkes run Angus cattle, like most farmers around here. Robert Bourke is too old for it now though. He wants to move somewhere easier, somewhere warmer. A little shack by the beach. That's why he's put the place up for sale. But he's having a tough time selling.
"And we'll get less now," he says, given the threat of compulsory acquisition. "This won't help us."
The house he's trying to sell is a beautiful white weatherboard, framed by a long row of trees that have lost their leaves. They're pretty, but they have caught a disease, Mr Bourke says. They'll all need to be felled.
He leaves us sitting in the kitchen with his wife, Viv, as he wanders into the back of the house. "It comes up all the time, the airport. It's been going on for years and years," she says.
He returns with a couple of scrapbooks. He's kept clippings of nearly every mention of a proposed Monomeith airport going back to the '70s. There are pages and pages of yellowing newsprint, pictures of men and women standing in his muddy paddock, waving their arms like plane wings, dollar signs in their eyes.
"The theory that an airport commissioned during World War II could be brought back into play has been exposed as foolish, or overambitious at best.
"Rob Bourke, who lives at Monomeith, argues the old airfield is lucky to carry a tractor when wet, let along a fully ladened passenger aircraft. It's pie in the sky stuff, he says".
"I haven't been diligent with keeping the cuttings of the current ones, because I thought it would all drift away again," Mr Bourke says.
The earth around Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang is covered in green, except where construction machinery has torn great furrows into it for new housing estates, exposing the rich peat beneath.
The whole region used to be part of the Great Swamp, thousands of hectares of bog and bulrushes between Melbourne and West Gippsland.
It was drained decades ago, leaving behind some of the best soils in Australia, the world even, locals say.
Nearly all of Australia's asparagus is grown here. During growing season phalanxes of green spears push up through the soil towards the sun. They call it the "golden mile". This is the sort of produce the airport's backers are hoping to ship to China.
But that's changing now. The bulldozers have moved in. New housing estates are being built on what was once farming land. Estate agent Matthew Robins is selling house-and-land packages from $410,000. He says he's already sold nearly 30 and he has not even built a display property yet.
Wooden skeletons of what will one day be houses and shops, families and employees, dot the paddocks.
How big is this town going to get? "You cannot get a picture of numbers, it's too hard to work it out," Mr Robins says.
A real estate agent, who did not want to be named, says he's had dozens of calls from land speculators since the news about the airport broke. They are trying to get in before prices go up. "The demand for land is huge, it's unprecedented," he says.
People are coming, in their thousands. But Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang are one-street towns, a servo, a shopping centre, a bank, a couple of real estate agents, a run-down church. They only recently got natural gas plumbed in.
The area's infrastructure is not going to cope, says the agent.
"You want to get down here in Christmas, Easter, the roads don't cope even then." Other locals say it can take up to three hours to make the round trip to pick someone up from Tullamarine airport.
There is an old railway line that leads out here, but that was decommissioned in 1993.
Successive governments played hokey-pokey with South Gippsland's swing-voters, putting a rail revival on then off then on again for several years, until in 2012 part of the line was ripped up and converted into a bike trail.
The towns are serviced by bus, which takes about an hour to get into Melbourne.
"The big thing is, what is going to happen when all these people move in?" says Laura McBride, franchisor of Bendigo Bank's five local branches.
The main streets here are still quiet on a weekday, the bakery's community noticeboard still telling small-town stories. Firewood sold by the kilo, dogs free to a good home. But Melbourne is coming. A craft-brewery-pub opened just last month, Ms McBride says.
"The growth in this area has been huge."
It's growth that not everyone is happy with. Koowee, as the locals call it, is an old town, full of third-generation farmers and tree-changers.
"It's split the community," one Lang Lang small business owner says. She does not want to give her name for fear of getting caught up in the conflict. Businesses are excited about an injection of activity into the local economy, about how many thousand jobs the airport might create, she says; tree-changers, who came here to get away from the hustle and bustle of the city, are less thrilled.
"It'll be good for the community – I just don't want to be in the flight path," she laughs.
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/cow-d ... x600z.html
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Re: New international airport?

Postby Mitch » Mon Jul 10, 2017 12:24 am

Whilst I don’t disagree with the idea of a third airport for Melbourne to the east, I think the government and respective airlines should deliver on its original commitment of upgrading Avalon to international status before planning a third airport. The other issue I see with the third airport is that because it would be so far east, would it only really cater to those living in that area? Comparing distances from Avalon to Melbourne and KWR to Melbourne, Avalon is not only closer but there is a hell of a lot less traffic going to Avalon in peak than what there would be to KWR.

Not only that, but I think it’s a bit of a “crying wolf” moment to tout that having an airport in the east will ease the pain of having to drive 3.5 hours from Gippsland to Tullamarine. By that logic, every small town and city in Australia will have a fully-fledged A380-capable airport.

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Re: New international airport?

Postby Roderick Smith » Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:58 am

Partly true Mitch. Avalon was chosen only because it was there, but it is in the wrong place for the bulk of the population. It is quite likely that Avalon would be full international before south-east is built. The vital issue today is reserving the land. In the world of railways, governments of both flavours have refused to reserve future alignments, and have even sold existing ones. Melbourne airport was reserved from the early 1950s, and was opened nearly 20 years later. At that stage, the ring road reservation was in place, but not built for another 20 years.
London had Heathrow, and convenient Gatwick. Both are used for long-haul international. It has now expanded to nearer regionals: Luton (north) and Stansted (east) (afaik for domestic and regional international), and built London City in docklands for stol aircraft on short-haul international flights to nearby European business centres.
Way back, Moorabbin was intended to be Melbourne's south-east airport. It gets some Bass Strait traffic, and did have the HARS Constellation land there as part of the 50th anniversary celebrations.
There is scope for Melbourne, and Essendon, and Avalon, and south-east and conceivably Mangalore, but certainly not all for long-haul. There is even scope for Fishermans Bend for stol to Canberra and Sydney, if a flight path can be found around the bridges.
In countries which have built new international to release capacity at the old one to domestic only, the new tends to be 50-60 km out (Tehran, Buenos Aires, Kuala Lumpur, Tokyo). Bangkok did well to get Suvarnabhumi so close in (and it is served by rail).

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Re: New international airport?

Postby krustyklo » Mon Jul 10, 2017 9:00 pm

Not only that, but I think it’s a bit of a “crying wolf” moment to tout that having an airport in the east will ease the pain of having to drive 3.5 hours from Gippsland to Tullamarine.

To be fair, the key question is how far it is from south eastern Melbourne suburbs such as around Dandenong and Frankston compared to Tullamarine (not to mention less traffic as it goes in the opposite direction to CBD bound traffic sharing the route to Tullamarine) without being right next to new housing estates that will limit its utility in several decades.

According to Google Maps:
Dandenong to Caldermeade is 50 minutes at 9pm, changing the time has no effect.
Dandenong to Tullamarine is 48 minutes at 9pm, setting the time for tomorrow morning 8am the estimate is between 60 and 90 minutes.

Frankston to Caldermeade is 41 minutes, at 8am the estimate is 40 to 55 minutes.
Frankston to Tullamarine is 61 minutes, at 8am the estimate is 65 to 100 minutes.

Hence as an approximation, at this point in time anywhere in a line roughly from Moorabbin to Springvale to Rowville would be no worse off for travel time under favourable road traffic conditions, and anywhere south east of that line would be better off. In peak hour there may well be a slightly greater catchment given the apparent difference traffic conditions make to travelling to Tullamarine. I would suspect that a small airport in the proposed location may actually make sense for the purposes of relieving Tullamarine and providing south east Melbourne with better access to air travel.

Now, if only we could reserve a rail alignment before the airport is built... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Gippsland_railway_line
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Re: New south-east airport? - and rail

Postby Roderick Smith » Tue Jul 11, 2017 12:39 pm

Casey Council warns southeast desperately needs airport, train line to Clyde, billions in road works.
Cranbourne Leader July 11, 2017.
A SOUTHEAST airport and billions in rail and road upgrades will head the City of Casey’s wishlist in the lead up to the 2018 election.
Following news that a private consortium wanted to build a $7 billion airport near Koo Wee Rup and Lang Lang, Cr Sam Aziz said the council would benefit from almost half a billion in income, thousands of new jobs as well as the benefits that would stem from bringing 5.1 million passengers through the area each year.
Cr Aziz said as well as making the airport an election wish, the council also wanted at least $2 billion in investment to upgrade roads in Casey and a promise that the Cranbourne rail line will be extended to service Clyde, Cranbourne East, and the new airport.
The council will advocate for the extension of the Cranbourne train line through to Clyde, which Leader has been campaigning for since March 2015. Picture: Jason Sammon He said in the next 20 years southeast Melbourne’s population would be greater than that of Tasmania and it didn’t make sense to drive 90 minutes or more to get to the airport at Tullamarine.
“(An airport in the southeast) will create 3000 new jobs and deliver a direct benefit of $120 million turnover each year and also $500 million in economic impact,” he said.
“We will be going to the next state election to engage both political parties to promise an undertaking that will deliver key infrastructure in terms of an arterial roads network, a rail transport network and extend the rail line into Clyde, which is Australia’s fastest-growing rail corridor.
“They (the State Government) have spent $1.4 billion in the west and we believe … that investment should be matched.”
Cranbourne Leader has been campaigning for the extension of the Cranbourne rail line through to Clyde, as part of its ‘Put Clyde Back on Track campaign.
Daniel Andrews and Matthew Guy did not respond to Leader’s questions.
RELATED: Infrastructure Victoria report says train line needed in 10-15 years.
RELATED: Badly needed train line could be 30 years away.
RELATED: Support grows for Cranbourne train line extension.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/sout ... d68feca1f0
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Re: New international airport?

Postby Leyland B21 » Tue Jul 11, 2017 8:52 pm

Living locally Clyde is growing at a rapid rate. Narre Warren - Cranbourne Rd along with Berwick - Clyde Rd have both recently / currently been upgraded. Both are struggling with traffic volume still along with many other main arterials namely Sth Gippy Hwy / Princes Hwy / Thompsons Rd etc. There are large gaps where at present public transport simply is not an option.

Clyde definately needs the railway returned as a matter of priority. My opinion though is if they build it, do it right and build the railway to Kooweerup and the new airport.

Then we have the other issue of Pax Loadings on the train. Both Cranbourne and Pakenham are struggling. Sardine can on either side of the peak at my local station Narre Warren. Not so much sardine cans on the Cranbourne Line but at the rate of growth around the region Cranbourne line is now almost under pressure also taking into account single track for a fair part.

Im a firm believer that with Skyrail etc the line should be quadrupled from the start. Trains from dandenong stopping all stops to the city inbetween limited expresses all day between Dandenong and the city for Pakenham / Cranbourne. Maybe the case of sharing 3rd and 4th tracks stopping at main points inline with VLine like Clayton / Caulfield but throw Oakleigh into the mix for those accessing Chadstone SC.

Back to the main point. Casey City Council have been screaming about the issue for some time and its continually falling on deaf ears.

The longer it takes to be done. The more its going to cost.

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