Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
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Wfc1
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Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Wfc1 »

Hello everyone. Although I have been a regular user of this forum for many years this is the first time I have posted as a member. I am calling on the extensive knowledge and memory of any of the older hands that may be able to help me identify a vehicle that I knew back in the 1970s in Sydney. In 1978 I started my bus driving career at the mature age of 21 driving for Cumberland Coaches out of Wangee rd Lakemba on the 34 run. I was on number1 shift, the first out at 535am. The usual bus was 368, one of the Adelaide leylands and 190 in the pm. I know some of you will find it hard to believe but these machines were not always trouble free and quite often a spare was used. If you were lucky it was often 4375, one of the leopards. It could also be the other end of the scale as well, sometimes ex Stones mo320 which lived at Lakemba at that time, still in Stones colours. One bus that was there was a custom coach bodied step deck, coach seats, mid engine leyland. A chap that worked there at the time, probably known by a few people here, explained to me when I had to use it for the first time that it was not what it seemed. He told me it was a rebody of a tiger cub. It had a crash box, old style alloy centred steering wheel and was a hand full to drive on the 34 route in peak hour. Some of the research we have done reveals that John Burke of Commodore coaches had a rebodied tiger cub when he was operating before Cumberland bought him out. I am assuming this may be the bus at Lakemba. I thought we had cracked it when I spotted a pick of the Leyland Lion that Cumberland had that ended up on the south coast, but this would not have had a crash box or mid engine. Sorry for the long winded post but I have exhausted all my search options, having even spoken to people that were there at the time. Even a rego number would do as we could then maybe track it a bit further. Thanks in advance. Bruce.
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Atlantean 1016
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Atlantean 1016 »

Hi Bruce, the Lion you speak of was m/o5801 a PSR1/1 with a CCMC body dated 11/05/72, it was a deck & half body, front and rear doors (RC43D), fleet number 42 and originally from the Rydalmere depot.
The Tiger Cub could have been m/o5802 a PSUC1/2, crash box chassis no: 545595. This chassis came from UK Diesels secondhand to Cumberland Coaches, who rebodied it as a deck & half CCMC body dated 29/04/72. (RC47D). This unit carried number 42 in the Cumberland fleet. The only other Cub I remember from those days was m/o157, although it was a Royal Tiger Cub , the chassis also coming from UK Diesels although bodied by Smithfield Bus & Coachworks. It carried fleet number 45 and was one of very few "Gold Star" bodied deck & halfs built, the majority going to rebodied CRT2/1 Worldmasters for Parramatta Bus Company, one to Bosnjak's Edensor Park, m/o071 Leyland Leopard (with electric two speed diff) and two VK55's m/o052 and m/o061, both based at Edensor Park. It was amazing to see these private buses among a sea of PTC Blue Leopards, the second batch of 312 being built for the Department, with the badge off one landing on m/o071!
Wfc1
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Wfc1 »

Thankyou for that info, it could very well be the bus that we spoke of. The only problem is the Tiger Cub rebody that belonged to Commodore was listed as going to Cumberland in 1977, according to the Compass Tours history on their website, so it would have not been Cumberland that bought the chassis in 1972 and had it bodied. There may be another in the mix.The Commodore bus was described as a step deck, semi coach, Custom Coach body. I wonder if there were two. A good friend that worked for ccmc at that time remembers putting bodies on second hand chassis and seems to think that some of them came from one of the airline companies.
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Centralian
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Centralian »

I've gone back to my 1975 HCVA Sydney Fleet lists and note that at some unknown time I have added in biro to the fleet of North Epping Bus Service the Leyland T.C. PSUC1/2 that
Atlantean 1016 refers to above - chassis 545595 with CCMC body which I've recorded body number as 71.513. ex Cumberland 5802, and I have it as mo 5460 with Burke T/A North Epping BS & Commodore Coaches.
For that amount of detail I must have copied it from the HCVA magazine 'HCVA News' or 'Fleetline' .

In the '70's I lived in Blacktown next to a former regular poster on here GM, and one of the Burke/Commodore drivers lived in our street and would overnight his vehicle there sometimes. I've photographed their Mastiff and Ford in the street (photo appears in the Commodore Coaches history on the Compass site) and I think I recall a CCMC raised deck vehicle at some time, although I don't recall having photographed same.
Think for yourself, while it's still legal !
Wfc1
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Wfc1 »

Thankyou to both of you for that info. It looks like I have a rego number now and may be able to trace it a bit further from there. I remember most of the regos from Lakemba but mostly the ones I drove and the bus in question was a blank. I moved to the mountains straight from that job and started at Pearces at Valley Heights and the next time I went past Wangee Rd the buses were all a different colour. I should be able to check the lists now I have a rego and see if the Leyland in question went to the new owners.
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Atlantean 1016
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Atlantean 1016 »

I believe Centralian is on the money, my records show the same Cycles body number for m/o5802. I couldn't make the Commodore connection, however, Centralian has confirmed your bus I believe Bruce. I was crazy about information in the 60's and 70's, recording everything I could about all the Sydney private buses. Many bus operators looked in bewilderment as I took a wire brush underneath old half cabs etc. searching for chassis numbers. Vic Hayes was instrumental in letting me know where to look on AEC's Leylands etc.. I knew all the Albions, they were my passion, still are. If I get under a bus now, I battle to get back up! Hence the long time having ex PTC Leopard 1554 ready for the road.
Wfc1
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Wfc1 »

I can relate to the number collecting. We lived on Kingsgrove Rd when I was growing up and I can remember sitting in the front yard during happy hour when all the buses were on their way to work from the depot busily recording numbers and times. Even worse is the fact that I still have that notebook tucked away somewhere over 50 years later. When Deluxe shut up shop I was with them and remember keeping the auction catalogue with all the hammer prices written on as well. I still have that somewhere so don't worry about collecting info as someone will be thankfull that it was done one day. Transport archaeology I call it. Bruce.
VIKing
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by VIKing »

Cumberland owned this Tiger Cub twice. It was built new for them, they sold it in 2/76 to John Burke at North Epping BS, then reacquired it when they purchased the entire North Epping business 4/8/77. Cumberland sold the vehicle to Bowman, Forbes in 5/79..
Wfc1
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Re: Cumberland Coaches Leyland tiger cub.

Post by Wfc1 »

Thankyou Viking for that bit of info. When Atlantean 1016 said that it was bodied by Cumberaland it made me wonder how that was when it went to them after they bought the Eastwood operation from John Burke. It makes perfect sense now. I have found a picture in the photo gallery of the same bus taken at Forbes dated 1985, thanks to your research. Atlantean 1016 is going back the other way to see if we can trace the previous life of this chassis before the rebody. Bruce.
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