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STA Observations 2019

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:59 am

Stu wrote:
Fleet Lists wrote:It appears that route 32 which normally operates to Randwick Racecourse on race days is not operating either Saturday or Monday this weekend.
https://transportnsw.info/events/2019/0 ... k-race-day
https://transportnsw.info/events/2019/0 ... l-randwick


Maybe the ATC is anticipating low crowd numbers and has decided not to charter buses for route 32.

Are they "chartered"? I thought normal fares apply on these services.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:36 am

https://web.archive.org/web/20190405031 ... 190413.pdf Timetable for 13 April shows Integrated fares with racecourse entry tickets so no fares charged on buses.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:09 am

Perhaps there is a similar arrangement to Moore Park; some fares are integrated, others are paid direct?
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Stu » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:55 am

boronia wrote:Perhaps there is a similar arrangement to Moore Park; some fares are integrated, others are paid direct?


Correct, some events are integrated and some are not, sometimes I loose track of which and when so to speak. Melbourne Cup Day at Royal Randwick allows for transport to be included in the gate ticket, obviously huge crowds on that day plus route 33 is also in operation on that day.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby neilrex » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:20 pm

Those deals are a scam !

The event ticket price is loaded to pay for them. So, if you live in Kensington and walk to the venue, you still have to pay extra for transport you don't use. If you have reached your daily or weekly cap, or [had] a periodical ticket, you still have to pay an inflated event ticket price. If you ride there on your bicycle, you still have to pay an inflated event ticket price.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:51 pm

neilrex wrote:Those deals are a scam !

The event ticket price is loaded to pay for them. So, if you live in Kensington and walk to the venue, you still have to pay extra for transport you don't use. If you have reached your daily or weekly cap, or [had] a periodical ticket, you still have to pay an inflated event ticket price. If you ride there on your bicycle, you still have to pay an inflated event ticket price.

That sounds like robbery. I think the ACCC could find a way to at least make them explain why it should be permitted legally.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:16 pm

This has been happening for the Easter Show for years - no one has argued about that in the past.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:31 pm

^Speaking of, it's time the government compulsorily acquired the Sydney Showgrounds back from "the company". Enough of this Homebush is the future nonsense. The Olympics were nearly 20 years ago and the hype over that joint is over. Make them set up their studio there and bring back the Easter show to it's rightful place. What blockbusters have they been doing there anyway? The benefits haven't been very apparent since Nick Greiner made the decision to sell it off.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:34 pm

We again are getting totally off subject. Nothing to do with STA observations.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby captainch » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:52 pm

Swift wrote:^Speaking of, What blockbusters have they been doing there anyway?
....Well they did have the OPTUS TOWER SAGA...............does that count ................And as a test maybe they will susprise race goers with the new LIGHT RAIL CARS ....testing loads between the depot and central AS A TRIAL. Minister Constance needs some goood news for t.v news. instead of a few gliches!........................plus try out his new N.A.S.A control centre!
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:56 pm

One post moved to viewtopic.php?f=3&t=85960&start=100 which already covers this subject
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby moa999 » Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:32 pm

Special event notices for the Sunday Swans game now shows it as to/from Moore Park Bus Interchange rather than Driver Ave

Fleet Lists wrote:It appears that route 32 which normally operates to Randwick Racecourse on race days is not operating either Saturday or Monday this weekend.


Pretty sure it's only ever been for major race carnival days, typically Spring and Autumn carnival.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:59 pm

No, much more than that - there are at least 25 timetables over the past 15 months or so - and there are more which were not archived - see https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://t ... les/97-32*
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:06 pm

And here are 7 during July to October 2017 before the URL format was changed and probably more which were not archived https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://t ... bles/32-C*
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:21 pm

And on 22nd June another Randwick race meeting without any route 32 buses.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:16 am

I noticed signs in Eddy Ave this week that the 308 stop will move from Stand B to Stand C from 28 July.

I can understand the need for this, to allow more space for the buses to get into the right turn lane, but it seems odd that it is being announced so far in advance.

Is there a timetable change planned?
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby J_Busworth » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:15 pm

moa999 wrote:Special event notices for the Sunday Swans game now shows it as to/from Moore Park Bus Interchange rather than Driver Ave


Its looked about finished for at least a couple of weeks now, so not surprising that they would wish to use it.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby moa999 » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:57 pm

Previous game they still hadn't finished the fences.
Was used last week and seemed to work fairly well. Obviously much better than the temp facility on Driver Avenue.

Will they reinstate more services to the busway and use it as a regular stop?
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:12 pm

The timetable for route 1 for the NRL game tomorrow also shows the Interchange instead of Driver Ave,
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby J_Busworth » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:00 pm

Had an interesting experience today. Driver on the 400, telling me it was illegal for me to take a photo of his driver ID card, from well behind the no standing area whilst sitting at a red light (He was 13 minutes early - which isn't ok), before yelling I had to sit down as standing was too dangerous for him. Seemed very very odd. He didn't have much regard for safe driving either, clearly speeding. Probably how he ended up 13 minutes early.

Iv'e noticed a pattern recently where drivers in peak on high frequency runs such as the 400 simply run with no regard to the timetable. Was there a directive to maintain frequency but not times?
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:54 pm

^ He's lying or assuming incorrectly. You can't trespass the eyes.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:43 pm

J_Busworth wrote:Iv'e noticed a pattern recently where drivers in peak on high frequency runs such as the 400 simply run with no regard to the timetable. Was there a directive to maintain frequency but not times?

Not sure how drivers would even maintain a frequency. Service is so unpredictable, people just turn up and wait. Smart people with apps can at least see when the next one is coming.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby jpp42 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:48 pm

J_Busworth wrote:Had an interesting experience today. Driver on the 400, telling me it was illegal for me to take a photo of his driver ID card, from well behind the no standing area whilst sitting at a red light (He was 13 minutes early - which isn't ok), before yelling I had to sit down as standing was too dangerous for him. Seemed very very odd. He didn't have much regard for safe driving either, clearly speeding. Probably how he ended up 13 minutes early.

The effort to try to prevent you from recording his ID is certainly suspicious and inappropriate. But in defense of the 13 minutes early thing, is that possibly that the wrong run number was somehow programmed in at the start of the run, and the driver was actually driving to a different run? It's hard to believe the 400 ever being early...
Iv'e noticed a pattern recently where drivers in peak on high frequency runs such as the 400 simply run with no regard to the timetable. Was there a directive to maintain frequency but not times?

To be fair to drivers, long routes like this across huge amounts of varying suburban traffic are well known to be very poor with on-time running. There is also a scientifically proven "bus bunching" effect where if one bus is slightly late, it becomes later due to increased loadings while the buses behind catch up. This is very annoying to riders but is not anything the drivers are doing wrong. If you think about it from a driver perspective, there is really very little they can do to affect whether they're late or not.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby burrumbus » Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:07 pm

J_Busworth wrote:Had an interesting experience today. Driver on the 400, telling me it was illegal for me to take a photo of his driver ID card, from well behind the no standing area whilst sitting at a red light (He was 13 minutes early - which isn't ok), before yelling I had to sit down as standing was too dangerous for him. Seemed very very odd. He didn't have much regard for safe driving either, clearly speeding. Probably how he ended up 13 minutes early.

Iv'e noticed a pattern recently where drivers in peak on high frequency runs such as the 400 simply run with no regard to the timetable. Was there a directive to maintain frequency but not times?

STA drivers have been doing this since time immerorial.One of many reasons why the services are so unreliable and the buses bunch in groups of 2-4 buses..
No adequate supervision to prevent this from happening and not likely to change.
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Re: STA Observations 2019

Postby jpp42 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:33 pm

burrumbus wrote:
J_Busworth wrote:Iv'e noticed a pattern recently where drivers in peak on high frequency runs such as the 400 simply run with no regard to the timetable. Was there a directive to maintain frequency but not times?

STA drivers have been doing this since time immerorial.One of many reasons why the services are so unreliable and the buses bunch in groups of 2-4 buses..
No adequate supervision to prevent this from happening and not likely to change.


These are actually contradictory statements. Bus bunching results from one bus being delayed and subsequent ones trying to keep to the timetable. Bus bunching is highly annoying to passengers, and a possible *remedy* to bunching is to make a "directive to maintain frequency but not times." If such a directive were issued, it might require delaying buses at certain interchange points so frequencies are maintained and actually causing some buses to run later. I don't think this is done in practice in Sydney, as it would hurt the punctuality statistics that bus companies are measured by.

Bus bunching is a scientifically proven effect and is by no means the fault of the driver. Various remedies to it can also be themselves annoying (such as delaying subsequent buses). One other remedy is to avoid such super long routes- that's partly why some of the longer cross-suburban routes have recently been truncated, such as 389 only reaching Bondi Junction, and the extended part to North Bondi replaced by 379.
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