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Sydney Metro West announced

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Sydney Metro West announced

Postby jpp42 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:49 pm

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-11-1 ... fmredir=sm

ABC wrote:Sydney Metro West train linking CBD and Parramatta to be under construction within five years, operational in 10

Work on a metro train line linking Sydney's CBD with Parramatta, in the city's west, will start within five years, the State Government has announced.

The Sydney Metro West line will link the city, the western suburbs, the inner-city Bays Precinct and Sydney Olympic Park.

New stations will be built at Parramatta and Olympic Park, but the service will not be operational for about 10 years, with a completion date of between 2025 and 2029.

Premier Mike Baird said the train will move about 40,000 people an hour in each direction, relieving congestion.

There is little detail in the plans about the exact route or additional stops along the line.

Transport and Infrastructure Minister Andrew Constance said the project needed feedback first.

"We're following the same process that we did with Sydney Metro Northwest, City Metro City and City Metro South West," he said.

"We've announced where we are headed, we're going to go to market, get industry input, that's exactly the process we've followed and obviously [as] part of that we finalise the business case and the process.

"That's when you do announce the final costings, the final route and the number of stations."

The Government is yet to confirm the cost of the Sydney Metro West line, but industry experts put the final figure at about $10 billion.

It will be funded by both private investment and proceeds from the sale of electricity distributor, Ausgrid — which secured net $6 billion when it was partially sold last month.

Mr Baird said the project had been fast-tracked due to that sale.

"We don't want to sit on that, we want to put it to work and we want to put it to work on the most critical public transport need we have and this metro is it," he said.

No details, design or dollars: opposition

The opposition was quick to accuse the Baird Government of using the rail announcement as a diversion from Saturday's Orange by-election result.

The final result in Orange isn't known but the Nationals suffered a swing of more than 30 per cent against them and could lose the once safe seat to the Shooters, Fishers and Farmers Party.

Opposition planning spokesman, Michael Daley, questioned both the timing of the announcement and details around the funding model.

"The Government has rushed this announcement undercooked because they're desperate to talk about anything other than what happened in Orange on Saturday," Mr Daley said.
"There are no details, no design, no dollars attached.

"If they're going to spend this sort of money on a project like this, they should do the full analysis, including on what better options there might be — none of that work's been done."

Mr Daley added the State Government had used the funds from Ausgrid for different projects "two or three times over" since its sale.

'Zero downside' to rail project, business says

Director of the Western Sydney Business Chamber David Borger said there was "zero downside" to the train line which he said would "supercharge" Parramatta as a second CBD.

"The Western Line was built in 1855, it often travels of speeds of about 30km an hour, but this new metro could potentially go up to 160km an hour," Mr Borger said.

"It means that there'll be great jobs closer to home for people in outer Western Sydney, particularly Blacktown, Penrith areas.

"This is something that really should be bipartisan — it should be something all of Sydney gets behind."
Mr Borger said most of the rail line will need to be built underground, and could potentially connect with Badgerys Creek, further west, and Malabar, in Sydney's east, in the future.

"We just don't have additional corridors between Sydney and Parramatta," he said

"This will have to be tunnelled the whole way I would have thought, but there will be some opportunities to recoup some of those costs through development on top of the train stations."

He said the cost to travel on the new line will likely be higher than the cost of using the current western line.

POSTED MON NOV 14 10:06:25 EST 2016
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby jpp42 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:52 pm

Also covered by the Telegraph:


Sydney Metro West: New underground link will ease Western Line congestion

NSW Premier Mike Baird has unveiled plans for a new $10 billion metro rail line from the city to Parramatta snaking through the Bays Precinct and Olympic Park,

The government will use money from the $16 billion sale of Ausgrid as well as private investment to construct the project, which has been dubbed “Sydney Metro West”.

The line will be largely underground and will relieve the huge pressure on the Western rail line, which is nearing 100 per cent capacity.



Full article: http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/n ... a371607597
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Frosty » Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:21 pm

It looks like it will terminate in the CBD which would be weird. It feels not complete I feel like there needs to be like southern or northern extension.

This still leaves the issue of other overcrowded lines the next one being the T4 Line which is already nearly operating at 100%. 19tph during peak hour between Wolli Creek and Bondi Jn.

Something that is missing proper PT to Pyrmont and Darling Harbour hopefully Sydney Metro West could deal with it.

The idea of an extension to Malabar would be a good idea.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby marcnut1996 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:52 pm

One question that pops up immediately in my mind is, what will happen to Parramatta Light Rail from Parramatta to Olympic Park and Strathfield?

Then I found an article from the SMH: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/metro-rail-from-cbd-to-parramatta-confirmed--but-its-10b-and-10-years-away-20161113-gsol5l.html with the following lines

Mr Constance said the new metro link and the Parramatta light rail line were "two very different transport projects".

"Light rail is about connecting precincts – this project is obviously a mass-transit solution which is going to lead to connectivity between Parramatta and the CBD," he said.


Not sure what he meant by that. There's nothing between Parramatta and Olympic Park except Silverwater and maybe Rosehill Racecourse.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby boronia » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:35 pm

The intention of the P-OP LR was to facilitate development in that "nothing" area, through Camelia. It would feed into the Metro at either end.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby jpp42 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:43 pm

Frosty wrote:It looks like it will terminate in the CBD which would be weird. It feels not complete I feel like there needs to be like southern or northern extension.


To some extent this seems like this end of the project is a revival of the CBD Metro under Labor a while back. Obviously the Baird government doesn't want to admit that. But I wonder if behind the scenes they can reuse some of the work that was already done for that effort, like geotechnical surveys under Darling Harbour, White Bay, etc.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Rails » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:59 pm

I really hope that they run the West Metro to join the Airport line to Revesby (converted to Single Deck trains) rather than terminate it short in the CBD. Articles are stating that the Government are still considering the private sector proposal to run the line to the SE suburbs so I doubt there would be much further said on this yet. The Airport connection makes a lot of sense and will free up a lot of capacity on the City Circle. This Metro line from the west to Revesby and the branch of the C&SW Metro to Hurstville could take care of all the lines running at near capacity on the current network.

Its interesting that the comments suggest they are concentrating on relieving the T1 line and that the Parramatta Light Rail survives in its current proposed form, that to me says that they may not have stations between Parramatta and Olympic Park to support the mass development of these areas like Camelia and Silverwatter (Light Rail interchanging with the Metro will do this) and that this line will be more of an express Metro. If that is the case the big question seems to be how many stations this Metro line will have between the CBD and Parramatta and will it take over stations from the existing line from Parramatta to Blacktown or will they do something else?
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Transtopic » Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:03 pm

It is obvious as night follows day that this is nothing more than a rushed pre-emptive press release by the spin doctors to distract attention from the government's disastrous result in the Orange By-Election and resignation of the Deputy Premier. With so little detail given about the route, the intermediate stations and ultimate cost, it can't be given much credence, although it may well become a reality after it has been fully investigated. They clearly don't even know the facts yet. Submissions for the Joint Federal/State Western Sydney Rail Needs Scoping Study, which included this project as one of the options, only closed a fortnight ago, so it's a bit early to announce it as a given before submissions have even been fully examined. I don't think the Federal Government would be too impressed with this attitude when they're likely to be contributing some of the funding. I also wouldn't put too much faith in the Transport Minister's rhetoric about building both the metro and light rail link through the Olympic Park corridor. It would be a wasteful duplication when other parts of Sydney are crying out for new transport infrastructure, eg. a light rail link from Parramatta to Macquarie Park. There has already been a softening up process in the media about the possibility of replacing the Olympic Park light rail link with a Western Metro (which I would support).

The government's press release a fortnight ago, prior to the Orange poll, about its accelerated program to replace the NSW Regional Train Fleet, also short on detail, can be treated in the same vein. This government is now on the back foot and is in desperation mode to spin its way out of trouble. They're treating the public like mugs and if they continue with this attitude they will find themselves out of office at the next election.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby rogf24 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:26 pm

I would prefer that the metro continues the eastern part of Waterloo and the Green Square development rather go on the existing line so I prefer the plan of the developers. That area is currently slated for light rail, which is a joke considering the planned density of the area and closeness to the city. The line can then continue down to Kingsford for a connection to the CSELR and then La Perouse with an elevated railway on the median of Anzac Parade so it will roughly follow the 343 bus (I know, I've said this before), the last part isn't as critical for now but will be cheapish considering it's not underground. The City Circle part can be solved by splitting East Hills Line suburban train trains before Wolli Creek (to Airport or Illawarra Locals) and terminating some at Central, terminating can be done at the existing Central suburban platforms since 2 platforms will become useless after the Bankstown Line conversion or Sydney Terminal using the Illawarra Dive.

It says that it will relieve the T1 Line but that's quite vague, there are many ways to help relieve the suburban line with the metro. You could take over the line to Blacktown but another branch you could be taking over is the Old Main South Line to Cabramatta with a metro, maybe you can do both and branch it. After that, you could have the T2 Inner West Line terminate at Parramatta and maybe have a double-decker suburban branch to Liverpool via Regents Park restoring that service. Yes, I would prefer more stations between Parramatta and the City, I don't like a metro too characteristic of suburban rail and besides you are really brushing aside the potential of Camellia or other growth areas, infill areas and existing high-ish density (residential or commercial) areas with that will benefit from better public transport or less traffic. The planned Parramatta to Strathfield Light Rail, if it's staying, should still go all the way to Strathfield to help serve the Underwood Road area, which is the largest growth area in the WestConnex renewal corridor.

After that, if we really need it, maybe you can build a dedicated express tunnel for fast trains to Badgery's Creek and high-speed rail. But if you're strapped for cash, you can go the Japanese option overtaking I posted a video of in another thread.

Other than that, this seems to be a pointless announcement with nothing exactly determined off the back of the poor results in Orange. Good chance to recycle some animations too.
Last edited by rogf24 on Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby simonl » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:02 pm

Decongest the Western Line? Give me a break. Only if it has few intermediate stations and provides through services.

This looks very similar to the NW Metro in that it has no price tag or detail but the proposal is of a lower quality and similar likelihood of happening.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby GazzaOak » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:19 pm

jpp42 wrote:To some extent this seems like this end of the project is a revival of the CBD Metro under Labor a while back. Obviously the Baird government doesn't want to admit that. But I wonder if behind the scenes they can reuse some of the work that was already done for that effort, like geotechnical surveys under Darling Harbour, White Bay, etc.


I bloody can't get into my head that why would Labor canceled the CBD metro a long while back.... that was an actually an good idea, and that is coming from a right wing guy that would never vote for labor.

At least this government is doing something about it.

Also with the Olympic Park metro station, they should really get rid of that stupid spur line once the Olympic Park metro station is built, and maybe start to utilize the parking lots there for ride and park by giving transport users an discount for parking there.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Frosty » Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:10 pm

I was thinking of the line moving to serve Zetland, Waterloo, Green Square run via Domestic Airport then onto Botany, East Botany, Eastgardens and Maroubra. I would think of an idea that Hurstville all stop trains run via the City Circle on the local tracks and East Hills trains share the track. That would open up another 6 slots on the T4 Line. Providing the Airport Line was converted. So 12-14tph for East Hills then Hurstville all stops 6-8tph.

Platform 20 is very handy for operational purposes allows for a train to be parked in the platform in peak hour ready to go. Along with Platform 22 good terminating platform as it doesn't block trains unlike P19.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Tonymercury » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:56 am

marcnut1996 wrote:
Not sure what he meant by that. There's nothing between Parramatta and Olympic Park except Silverwater and maybe Rosehill Racecourse.



dependent on which way you intend to go - UWS.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby neilrex » Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:11 pm

This reinforces the public perception that public transport only serves the CBD. If the source or destination of your journey doesn't involve the CBD, you'd better have a car.

There is already a train to Parramatta
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby flitter » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:27 pm

marcnut1996 wrote:
Not sure what he meant by that. There's nothing between Parramatta and Olympic Park except Silverwater and maybe Rosehill Racecourse.


There's nothing there now except the huge, empty ex-industrial but mostly derelict Camelia area. However, that's about to have thousands of apartments built there in conjunction with the light rail.

http://www.planning.nsw.gov.au/camellia


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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby Transtopic » Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:20 pm

simonl wrote:Decongest the Western Line? Give me a break. Only if it has few intermediate stations and provides through services.

Agree. More spin. It doesn't do anything to allow more services from the Outer West and Richmond Lines through to the CBD unless passengers are forced to change at Parramatta to the metro. What is needed is more track capacity through the inner city for outer suburban express trains which can't be provided by a metro and that means additional infrastructure for the Sydney Trains network. Expanding the capacity of the existing Western Main and Suburban Lines from Strathfield to the CBD to 24tph with ATO would be a start. Ultimately, a new express tunnel from say Granville to the CBD with perhaps one intermediate station at Strathfield is going to be necessary, but not as a metro. It could link up with a City Relief Line to interchange with the Barangaroo metro station. However, I would support the West Metro as a stand alone project with multiple stations along its route serving a new rail corridor.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby moa999 » Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:07 pm

With the stops as proposed it will undoubtedly be far quicker Parramatta to the CBD and thus will take pax off the Western line from Parrramatta and West, hence why it will decongest the line -- as well as adding new rail corridoors.

However with the expanse of the city any new lines are going to be mostly underground, where the station itself is the most expensive part meaning fewer stations -- with fillin serviced by buses/ light rail.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby lunchbox » Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:47 am

As former transport minister Peter Cox was wont to say..."It's just lines on maps".
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby simonl » Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:24 pm

moa999 wrote:With the stops as proposed it will undoubtedly be far quicker Parramatta to the CBD and thus will take pax off the Western line from Parrramatta and West, hence why it will decongest the line -- as well as adding new rail corridoors.

Where did you see the proposed stops? Far quicker?? The Redfern-Parra non stoppers still cover the journey in 22 minutes. A proper service might be 15 but it is difficult to see how that comment is correct.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby rogf24 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 7:25 pm

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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby boronia » Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:32 pm

Probably sponsored by a well known local property developer?
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby bambul » Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:39 pm

simonl wrote:
moa999 wrote:With the stops as proposed it will undoubtedly be far quicker Parramatta to the CBD and thus will take pax off the Western line from Parrramatta and West, hence why it will decongest the line -- as well as adding new rail corridoors.

Where did you see the proposed stops? Far quicker?? The Redfern-Parra non stoppers still cover the journey in 22 minutes. A proper service might be 15 but it is difficult to see how that comment is correct.

The shorter distance cuts out about 2-3km between Parramatta and Town Hall (assuming that's where the new line enters the CBD) plus the shorter dwell times from single deck could mean a 5-10 minute faster journey than would currently be possible (depending on the number of stations). All else equal.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby simonl » Thu Nov 17, 2016 3:32 am

For that to work there would need to be only 2-3 stops between Parramatta and Town Hall.
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby bambul » Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:37 am

simonl wrote:For that to work there would need to be only 2-3 stops between Parramatta and Town Hall.

Hence the "all else equal". ;)
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Re: Sydney Metro West announced

Postby eddy » Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:24 am

jpp42 wrote:http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-11-14/sydney-metro-west-train-linking-sydney-cbd-and-parramatta/8022564?pfmredir=sm

ABC wrote:[b]

New stations will be built at Parramatta and Olympic Park

POSTED MON NOV 14 10:06:25 EST 2016


Wonder where???
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