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Parramatta light rail

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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby simonl » Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:58 pm

No Windsor Rd route any more?

I guess we knew it never had a chance - as if two lanes on a busy 4 lane road could be taken for light rail.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby user13548 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:03 pm

simonl wrote:Looks like I put too much trust in ABC. Oh well, you live and learn.

They were using the old name for Sydney Olympic park. Remember when the Easter show moved from the city out west to Homebush. They haven't updated their thinking since the 1980's
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby mandonov » Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:50 pm

simonl wrote:No Windsor Rd route any more?

I guess we knew it never had a chance - as if two lanes on a busy 4 lane road could be taken for light rail.

You didn't expect them to build all of the lines at once did you? I think we're extremely lucky to be getting Strathfield AND Carlingford at once. Plus the route to Westmead can be the basis for an extension to Castle Hill.

I'm quite happy with this initial line. It also leaves open options for how to get to Macquarie Park.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby simonl » Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:53 pm

Well the PCC report suggested Macquarie Park and Windsor Rd would/should be built as stage one.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Daniel » Tue Dec 08, 2015 3:26 pm

The key message which seems to be missed here is "value capture". It has taken a while to get to this point, but watch this space as this is certainly an exciting concept for transport infrastructure delivery in NSW.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby moa999 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:30 pm

mandonov wrote:Media roundup:

Fairfax: Parramatta - Sydney Olympic Park
News Corp: Parramatta - Strathfield & Carlingford
Seven News: Westmead - Strathfield & Macquarie Park
ABC: Westmead - Homebush & Carlingford


And the winner is -- nobody. Great breaking journalism in this country. Seven and ABC get closest
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:55 pm

simonl wrote:No Windsor Rd route any more?

I guess we knew it never had a chance - as if two lanes on a busy 4 lane road could be taken for light rail.

Likewise Carlingford Rd.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Frosty » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:46 pm

Transtopic wrote:
simonl wrote:No Windsor Rd route any more?

I guess we knew it never had a chance - as if two lanes on a busy 4 lane road could be taken for light rail.

Likewise Carlingford Rd.


Instead of Carlingford Rd maybe Ray Road and Dunnrossil Ave that could work out instead. https://www.google.com.au/maps/place/Ca ... 1d2a392a8c
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:57 pm

mandonov wrote:I'm quite happy with this initial line. It also leaves open options for how to get to Macquarie Park.

They may well wait until an investigation is completed by the Department of Planning and Environment into enhanced transport links between Parramatta and Macquarie Park as part of the Metropolitan Strategy, before deciding on a light rail route along this corridor. It would no doubt also include improved road links. The Eastwood County Rd route stands out like a sore thumb, being the most direct route and on an existing reserved transport corridor. It could easily be utilised as a combined road and light rail link. Despite alleged 'engineering and environmental challenges', it is difficult to comprehend how it can be ignored when compared with other options. The Greater Sydney Commission will most likely take over responsibility for this planning study.

If you're talking about 'value capture', the redevelopment of Eastwood has more to offer than any other suburb along this corridor, including Epping and Carlingford.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby simonl » Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:00 pm

Possible but it is a bit of a deviation. Wrt ray rd

Be interesting to see how value capture will work out.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:26 pm

Frosty wrote:Instead of Carlingford Rd maybe Ray Road and Dunnrossil Ave that could work out instead. https://www.google.com.au/maps/place/Ca ... 1d2a392a8c

Still 4-lane roads through quiet residential areas, which means that street parking would have to be eliminated. That wouldn't go down too well with the locals. It's also an even longer and more indirect route than Carlingford Rd.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Frosty » Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:47 pm

Transtopic wrote:
Frosty wrote:Instead of Carlingford Rd maybe Ray Road and Dunnrossil Ave that could work out instead. https://www.google.com.au/maps/place/Ca ... 1d2a392a8c

Still 4-lane roads through quiet residential areas, which means that street parking would have to be eliminated. That wouldn't go down too well with the locals. It's also an even longer and more indirect route than Carlingford Rd.

May I suggest than the SELR an in particular Wansey Road thats even narrower than Ray Road in Carlingford. Look Wansey road and maybe that could work out for Ray Road and Carlingford maybe via Eastwood option and terminus Epping run it parallel to the main line railway.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby moa999 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:14 pm

Any views on what will happen to the Clyde-Camelia part of the rail - torn up presumably - can't imagine operating it makes sense?

Presumably someone at Carlingford will now have a longer journey to CBD. Light rail to Camelia, change to the Strathfield line, then change again to train
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Fleet Lists » Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:19 pm

They may want to keep the section to Rosehill for use on race days.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:36 pm

Frosty wrote:May I suggest than the SELR an in particular Wansey Road thats even narrower than Ray Road in Carlingford. Look Wansey road and maybe that could work out for Ray Road and Carlingford maybe via Eastwood option and terminus Epping run it parallel to the main line railway.

If you're suggesting the Eastwood option and running it parallel to the Northern Line to Epping, what's the point of that when you've got a much shorter reserved corridor all the way to Macquarie Park?

I continue to be puzzled why everyone is trying to come up with alternative routes through Carlingford and Epping, but completely ignore the most logical route through Eastwood. They obviously haven't been there. It's the elephant in the room. While the link to Carlingford along the existing rail line is warranted, there is no need for a link from Parramatta to Macquarie Park via Epping. Apart from being longer than the more direct route via Eastwood, it duplicates the existing rail line between Epping and Macquarie Park. The route via Eastwood creates a new high capacity public transport corridor and still interchanges with the Northern Line and new North West Metro at Macquarie University, without the challenge of negotiating the Epping Town Centre. There is no advantage in running this light rail link through Epping. The redevelopment potential of Eastwood, already a significant retail/commercial centre, is enormous and successive State and local governments have ignored it for God knows why.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:00 pm

moa999 wrote:Any views on what will happen to the Clyde-Camelia part of the rail - torn up presumably - can't imagine operating it makes sense?

Presumably someone at Carlingford will now have a longer journey to CBD. Light rail to Camelia, change to the Strathfield line, then change again to train

There was a recent proposition that the Carlingford Line south of Camellia will form part of the future light rail extension to Bankstown via Granville. Camellia would become a hub, linking to Parramatta, for the 3 light rail routes, north, south and east. The Camellia planning study also proposed a new freight line link from Clyde along the existing rail corridor and turning in an easterly direction into the Camellia industrial area along an alignment on the southern side of Rosehill Racecourse. This is subject to further investigation.

Carlingford passengers will have a direct link to Parramatta where they can interchange to Sydney Trains. There will be no need for double interchanging.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby moa999 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:05 pm

Going all the way to Parramatta would definitely increase journey times to inner suburbs
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:09 pm

moa999 wrote:Going all the way to Parramatta would definitely increase journey times to inner suburbs

That's the compromise. It would still be faster than changing at Camellia and again at Strathfield.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby boronia » Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:38 pm

Transtopic wrote:
moa999 wrote:Any views on what will happen to the Clyde-Camelia part of the rail - torn up presumably - can't imagine operating it makes sense?

Presumably someone at Carlingford will now have a longer journey to CBD. Light rail to Camelia, change to the Strathfield line, then change again to train

There was a recent proposition that the Carlingford Line south of Camellia will form part of the future light rail extension to Bankstown via Granville. Camellia would become a hub, linking to Parramatta, for the 3 light rail routes, north, south and east. The Camellia planning study also proposed a new freight line link from Clyde along the existing rail corridor and turning in an easterly direction into the Camellia industrial area along an alignment on the southern side of Rosehill Racecourse. This is subject to further investigation.

Carlingford passengers will have a direct link to Parramatta where they can interchange to Sydney Trains. There will be no need for double interchanging.

Why would they want a freight rail line into Camellia when they are getting rid of heavy industry in the area? I am sure that elimination of the parramatta Rd level crossing is high on the agenda.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby ar157 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:14 pm

moa999 wrote:Any views on what will happen to the Clyde-Camelia part of the rail - torn up presumably - can't imagine operating it makes sense?

Presumably someone at Carlingford will now have a longer journey to CBD. Light rail to Camelia, change to the Strathfield line, then change again to train

Don't most people living in Carlingford take the 546/549/m54 to Epping and change there instead of heading south towards Camellia/Parramatta.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Transtopic » Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:27 am

boronia wrote:Why would they want a freight rail line into Camellia when they are getting rid of heavy industry in the area? I am sure that elimination of the parramatta Rd level crossing is high on the agenda.

The southern and eastern precincts of Camellia are being retained for industrial uses, including the Shell storage facility. This is why a new freight line is proposed to service this area, which could become a major distribution centre. As I mentioned earlier, it is subject to further investigation. No doubt the Parramatta Rd level crossing will be included in this investigation.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Geo101 » Wed Dec 09, 2015 4:20 am

Would this allow the removal of the Olympic Park Sprint from Lidcombe?

With light rail access from Parramatta and Strathfield the heavy rail could be reduced to special event services only, and possibly some peak hour services to central.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby simonl » Wed Dec 09, 2015 6:45 am

Geo101 wrote:Would this allow the removal of the Olympic Park Sprint from Lidcombe?

Interesting possibility. I don't see why not.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby Fleet Lists » Wed Dec 09, 2015 6:57 am

I thought that would definitely be on the cards.
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Re: SMH: Roads Minister Duncan Gay hints @ Olympic Pk light

Postby mandonov » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:20 am

Transtopic wrote:There was a recent proposition that the Carlingford Line south of Camellia will form part of the future light rail extension to Bankstown via Granville. Camellia would become a hub, linking to Parramatta, for the 3 light rail routes, north, south and east. The Camellia planning study also proposed a new freight line link from Clyde along the existing rail corridor and turning in an easterly direction into the Camellia industrial area along an alignment on the southern side of Rosehill Racecourse. This is subject to further investigation.

Carlingford passengers will have a direct link to Parramatta where they can interchange to Sydney Trains. There will be no need for double interchanging.

Parramatta Council had the Bankstown LR line going down Church Street past the Westfield and Auto Alley. I think it was the Westline Partnership's idea to use the southern section of the Carlingford Line.

Image

I imagine we could get something similar to this map from Parramatta Council (via the Transport Sydney blog).
We'll start off with Strathfield and Carlingford, with a future branch via Eastwood to Macquarie Park, and lines from Castle Hill and Bankstown.
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