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Switching drivers

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Re: Switching drivers

Postby sunnyyan » Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:24 pm

^ South
It's actually spelt Clemton Park. And also how do bus drivers know whether the changeover is inside the depot or outside. Because I regularly see changeovers inside the depot on the 490/2 even when it isn't raining or hot.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Stu » Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:55 pm

^ Spelling corrected.

When the weather appears to be threatening to rain the duty officer will make the call to have relief inside. The radio room will make a broadcast. Sometimes a bus may go inside the depot as it may have become defective, whether the bus is due for relief or not, the defective bus can be swapped over for another bus.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Glen » Mon Mar 20, 2017 10:47 pm

Swift wrote:A couple of times when I travelled on a 461 from Strathfield Station to the City Via Parramatta Rd, the bus would turn right into Burwood depot and a relief would take place in the there, before the bus exited out the side street entrance and turn right back onto Parramatta Rd to resume the journey.
This was in the late 1990s and I remember I was in a brand new Volvo B10BLE with Orana body and how nice it sounded then! It was one of the later 39** batch and I remember a young woman passenger smiling while she watched a couple of drivers cracking jokes at each other in the depot forecourt. :lol:

Lest this thread be totally about govvie buses, a long time ago Westbus (Hillsbus) used to do mid-point reliefs at Northmead Depot by the northbound bus turning off Windsor Rd and going via Boundary Rd, into the Depot, through the shed, then back out along Kleins Rd and James Ruse Dr.

That added quite a few minutes to the trip but no extra time was allowed.

These days I don't know that CDC drivers do any mid-point reliefs, do they?

Transdev drivers change over at a number of places near to their Depots, mainly on the medium to long length routes, using cars or staff buses for relief.

Hopkinsons drivers used to change over at Fairfield Rd & Albert St, Woodpark, before A3MC lost Region 3.

What about other private operators?
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Stu » Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:20 pm

East.
Port Botany.
* Staff bus:
- Anzac Pde & Botany St, Kingsford: 393, 395, 396, 397 & 399. (inbound)
- Anzac Pde & Wallace St, Kingsford: 393, 395, 396, 397 & 399. (outbound)
- King & Sutherland St's, Mascot: 303. (both directions)
- Day Ave & Anzac Pde, Kensington: 303. (both directions)
- Stephen Street, Mascot: 310. (both directions)
- Bunnerong Rd & Franklin St, Matraville: 392. (both directions)
- Anzac Pde, Little Bay: L94. (outbound)
- Anzac Pde, Malabar: L94. (outbound)
- Joynton Ave, Zetland: M20. (both directions)
- Botany shops: M20. (terminus)
- Maroubra Junction: M10. (terminus)
- La Perouse: 391, 394 & L94. (terminus)


Randwick.
* Travel on foot:
- Cooper St & Mulwaree St, Randwick: 372, 373, 374, 376 & 377. (both directions)
- Darley & Alison Rd's, Randwick: 339. (both directions)
* Staff bus:
- Cooper St & Mulwaree St, Randwick: 372, 373, 374, 376 & 377. (both directions) (use a staff bus during the evening)
- Darley & Alison Rd's, Randwick: 339. (both directions) (use a staff bus during the evening)
- Coogee Beach: M50. (terminus)


Waverley.
* Travel on foot:
- Waverley Depot: 333, 352, 355, 380, 389 & 440. (both directions)
- Bondi Junction Interchange: M40. (terminus)
- Bondi Junction Interchange: 200, 360, 381 & 400. (terminus) (very rarely used)
* Staff bus:
- Darlinghurst Rd & Oxford St, Darlinghurst - Taylor Sq: 311. (both directions) (drivers must special via route 389 and park staff bus on Darlinghurst Rd facing South) (relief
used to happen on Burton St many years ago)
- Edgecliff Interchange - upper level: 324 & 325. (outbound)
- Edgecliff Interchange - upper level: 326 & 327. (terminus)
- Edgecliff Interchange - lower level: 324 & 325. (inbound) (park staff bus on upper level and walk down stairs/escalator to the inbound bus stop)

NO LONGER USED:
- Eastgardens Westfield: 400. (outbound) (park staff bus on lower level and walk up ramp to the outbound bus stop)
- Eastgardens Westfield: 400. (inbound) (park staff bus on lower level)
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Stu » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:25 am

* When the former operator Connex took over Baxters services, there was a late afternon service from Parrmatta to Bankstown via Villawood and Bass Hill would have relief on Woodville Rd (route 907 today) - staff bus to and from the former Baxters Villawood Depot which was in operation by Connex and then Veolia for a few years until South Granville opened. Question; when the name change (change of owner) from Veolia to Transdev happened, did Transdev operate out of the Villawood Depot or did Veolia move out and then into the new South Granville Depot just before Transdev took over?

* STA Western Sydney Buses 2003-2013.
T80 - relief at Bonnyrigg on the T-Way. (both dirctions) (staff car). Does anyone know if relief takes place near the Transit Systems Smithfield Depot for route T80?

* More recently:
Transdev: relief point on Blaxcell St, South Grnaville for route M91. (staff bus)
PBC: relief point on Bonds Rd & Hannans Rd, Riverwood. (travel)
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Swift » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:53 am

Didn't even know that private buses did relief.
Good to know!
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Tonymercury » Tue Mar 21, 2017 4:41 am

Swift wrote:Didn't even know that private buses did relief.
Good to know!



CDC seem to change both vehicle and driver.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Geoff » Tue Mar 21, 2017 5:08 am

Glen wrote:
Swift wrote:These days I don't know that CDC drivers do any mid-point reliefs, do they?

What about other private operators?


Hi Glen: generally CDC don't do that anymore; however Blue Mountains Transit still do it at Emu Plains Depot (Emu Heights services) and also Valley Heights on the 690P Penrith services. Not sure about Katoomba.

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Re: Switching drivers

Postby busboy700 » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:38 am

Back in the old days drivers we not allowed to cross the road at the relief point, the staff bus/ staff car had to be parked on the same side of the road as the bus they were relieving. If the roster said S/B then the relieving driver had to take a staff bus there was no walking to close relief points, or crossing the road If your journal said Travel then there was another staff bus going to the same relief point & you travelled on that staff bus... if you got caught by the depot inspector/or DM walking/crossing the road/ or relieving another driver at other than the relief point. you would be Failed As Rostered & get a note in your journal please explain to depot manager & the offending driver would get a "bung". in late 70"s early 80"s Pagewood had some stupid relief points, the 337 inbound/ outbound went straight past the depot entrance you could cross the road on the pedestrian crossing & be there in 2 mins but there was always a staff bus rostered, they gave the relieving driver 9 mins to drive around the block & park the staff bus on the outbound side of bunnerong rd. the inbound 337 changed over at the stop past the depot entrance again a 2 min walk but the relieving driver was rostered a staff bus & given 9 mins to drive there. If you cot caught relieving outside the depot it was failed as rostered & you would have a date with the DM the next day to explain why. The 358/359 to Double Bay/ Rose Bay terminated in the depot but there were some shifts where the relief point was bunnerong rd/ Maroubra rd outside the KFC five mins from the depot. Most drivers changed in the depot but if you caught you were Failed As Rostered & another date with the DM to explain why. 302/303 to mascot shops or the airport relieved at either King & botany st Or day & Anzac. at Kensington The 302/303 to Sans Souci or Caringbah would sometimes change in Clareville Ave Dolls Point. Most times if you were relieving an outbound 302/303 you would pass the other driver on the Grand Parade near Brighton most drivers would try & change before Clareville Ave but again if you got Caught another please explain to the DM. When we moved to Port Botany there was more stupid relief points the 337 inbound/ outbound to Botany Cemetery went straight past the depot, but the relieving driver was rostered staff bus & the relief point was Matraville Hotel. the 309 terminated in the depot outside the drivers room, but the relief point was Matraville Hotel Again most drivers changed at the depot but if the roster said s/b to m'ville hotel & the s/b didnt leave the depot again Failed As Rostered & another date set up with the DM for a please explain. It was like that for quite a while until it was changed
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby boronia » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:38 am

If don't know if that "no crossing the road restriction" was limited to one specific depot, but at Waverley, from the time it opened in 1960, reliefs were often made on passing outbound services which involved crews crossing Oxford St.

I don't usually use these services much any more, but I think it was still happening 3 or 4 years ago.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Free Lance » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:46 am

back in my time at "B" there was a change-over outside the depot (out bound), walking time from depot to pedestrian controlled lights(on Pittwater Road opposite depot) and then walk back to c/o locations. On some shifts with a short meal break we had to chase the in service bus to Narrabeen for a c/o as the extra minute meant the driver coming off a 40 minute meal break would thus be in legal requirements.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby transport1400 » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:01 am

Stu wrote:* When the former operator Connex took over Baxters services, there was a late afternon service from Parrmatta to Bankstown via Villawood and Bass Hill would have relief on Woodville Rd (route 907 today) - staff bus to and from the former Baxters Villawood Depot which was in operation by Connex and then Veolia for a few years until South Granville opened. Question; when the name change (change of owner) from Veolia to Transdev happened, did Transdev operate out of the Villawood Depot or did Veolia move out and then into the new South Granville Depot just before Transdev took over?

* STA Western Sydney Buses 2003-2013.
T80 - relief at Bonnyrigg on the T-Way. (both dirctions) (staff car). Does anyone know if relief takes place near the Transit Systems Smithfield Depot for route T80?

* More recently:
Transdev: relief point on Blaxcell St, South Grnaville for route M91. (staff bus)
PBC: relief point on Bonds Rd & Hannans Rd, Riverwood. (travel)


When the T-Way first opened (2004 if I remember) it wasn't uncommon for drivers to walk down from Bonnyrigg depot to Bonnyrigg T-Way station so that they could changeover.
Though this seemed to be done away with pretty early on. Then they started driving relief buses down to Bonnyrigg T-Way station and towards the end of the WSB Das they used staff cars and at one point had a ute.

TSA with T80 do driver relief outside the depot (Smithfield Tway heading towards Parramatta). Driver usually has a key to the gate to walk in the side entrance to the depot off the tway.
Liverpool bound the driver change often takes place at Warren Tway with a staff bus.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Glen » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:22 pm

Stu wrote:* When the former operator Connex took over Baxters services, there was a late afternon service from Parrmatta to Bankstown via Villawood and Bass Hill would have relief on Woodville Rd (route 907 today) - staff bus to and from the former Baxters Villawood Depot which was in operation by Connex and then Veolia for a few years until South Granville opened.

That was a long standing relief point going back to when Delwood operated that Depot.

Stu wrote:Question; when the name change (change of owner) from Veolia to Transdev happened, did Transdev operate out of the Villawood Depot or did Veolia move out and then into the new South Granville Depot just before Transdev took over?

South Granville Depot opened under the Veolia name. See:
viewtopic.php?t=71933&p=841246
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Frosty » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:34 pm

I'm surprised STA P depot or any depot doesn't do any driver swaps at Eastgardens it's one of the major interchanges in the Eastern Suburbs many P depot routes start and terminate there. I'm guessing most drivers just go off shift straight down to Port Botany down the road.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby iamthouth » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:12 pm

Westbus also had changeovers at Bonnyrigg Tway.

Hillsbus do not have it currently, but Blue Mountains Transit do at depots and with staff car elsewhere, and Hunter Valley Buses also do staff car changeover, and diversions into Edgeworth Depot.

Do Forest Coachlines do staff changeover, given the depot is along the route?
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby boronia » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:05 pm

Frosty wrote:I'm surprised STA P depot or any depot doesn't do any driver swaps at Eastgardens it's one of the major interchanges in the Eastern Suburbs many P depot routes start and terminate there. I'm guessing most drivers just go off shift straight down to Port Botany down the road.

I can't understand why inbound P Anzac Pde services get relief at Botany St, almost at Kingsford. If they have come from Little Bay, or even Maroubra, why aren't they relieved closer to the depot?
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Frosty » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:21 pm

Its like the logic of the m20 P being relieved at Joynton Ave surely Botany is closer to Port Botany depot. It would make sense for the Anzac Pde services to be relieved at like Maroubra or the various respective termni. The changeover for P once LR is done will probably move to the Kingsford LR terminus.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Free Lance » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:41 am

it would appear the most important consideration is "Work Time" for the drivers involved, without much consideration to the actual operating costs involved in the multitude of changer over locations.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Glen » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:32 am

The longer a route is, the harder it is to relieve, because the round trip work portions get longer.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Stu » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:47 am

Glen wrote:The longer a route is, the harder it is to relieve, because the round trip work portions get longer.


Not necessarily. Long distance trips can be cut up into different segments and works well if the depot is close to the relief points. This occurs with routes L90 & 400.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby simonl » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:12 am

I feel sure that I've seen a car, maybe a ute used on some occasions.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby boronia » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:51 pm

Some depots have trialled cars in the past, I can remember R having few some years ago, and T more recently as mentioned above.

Guess they are just not economic to run, when there are plenty of "free" buses sitting around
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Swift » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:52 pm

WIth cars, you have to find additional space. Space that could be used for staff parking. Even if it cost slightly more to use the buses overall, space is something not easily bought at today's depots.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Stu » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:35 pm

The use of cars and utes has become the norm in recent years for a number of reasons. I provided a reason for route 400 above which is solely due to physical/spatial issues at the bus stop. Some times the K-Depot ute may be used for the relief point in Burwood Rd, Belmore as that is a tight squeeze for two buses. Another reason for using the staff ute is due to a shortage of buses in the peak times.

In October last year, the Mitsubishi Triton model of ute previously used at numerous depots were replaced with Toyota Hilux models ute. The new Hilux at Tempe was recently replaced by a Hyundai i30. The Tempe staff car is the preferred vehicle of choice for relief whenever available.

At Randwick, after dark when travelling on foot is replaced by a staff vehicle, the ute is the preferred vehicle of choice when relieving at Cowper St & Mulwarre Ave. The ute is parked on the outbound side facing East which allows the driver returning to the depot to simply turn left into Mulwaree Ave. It would be near impossible to send a bus down Mulwaree Ave.
On thing I forgot to previously mention about the outbound relief at Cowper St & Mulwarre Ave is the fact that a relief point only J-stem/bus stop exists here, the same situation with the M41 relief point at Concord for services heading to Macquarie Park. During the evening, the vehicle of choice for relief at Darley Rd, Randwick is a bus.
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Re: Switching drivers

Postby Frosty » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:52 pm

It would make sense for Tempe to use the staff car for Joynton Ave m20 and Botany Shops terminus. Since at Botany shops I've seen two buses often two bendies parked up together probably due to late running. It really tight to fit a third bus the fact also it's a relief for P and T. Joynton Ave I've seen there be less room for buses due construction work nearby to layover the other day some bus driver decided to park on the pedestrian crossing
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